2.7 V's 3.0

[EV2UK]

OK..

How does the 2.7 tdi stack up against the 3.0 tdi ?

Does the extra 300cc make all that much difference ?

I see that only a few posts below it has been stated that the 2.7 is the same as the 3.0 but only with a shorter stoke. so the questions are..

1). Do both versions share the same turbos
2). Is the 2.7 as smooth as the 3.0 and is it as well refined
3). although it's said that the 2.7 can be re-mapped to 3.0 levels but I have read that re-mapping a 2.7 isn't a great idea due to the extra tourque being put throught the gearbox and torque converter etc..

With reguard to the last question surley the same running gear is used in both the 2.7 & 3.0.?

Also (if it makes any difference) the above questions are with a tip-tronic box in mind..



...so 2.7 or hold out for a 3.0.?



Thank you

Tony

[adamss24]

Complete different engines and that extra 300CC and larger turbo makes all the difference ! You can compare the 2.7 to a 2.5 tdi as it's a touch smoother and with a better power deliver, on the other hand the 3.0 Tdi is a brute of an engine ! Go drive them both, you wont be dissapointed, throw a remap in the works and the larger v6 lump will upset a lot of more expensive exotica's + still return 40Mpg if taken easy !

[Milu-]

Not sure i agree with above.
The 2.7 engine is the newer design like the 3.0.
The old 2.5 was not nearly as good.

I usually go for the 'best' in a range,ie 3.0 but a 2.7 came up that suited my needs so I bought it.I've been really happy so far and enjoy the good mix of performance and economy.

[ruggedscot]

As an owner of a 2.7 I think you may guess what one I liked. The 3.0 has an auto and 4wd which tends to make me wary a fair bit to go wrong and pretty expensive if it does. I looked for a while and eventually settled on a 2.7 fwd manual. simple set up and it does do what I require it to do. Its been reliable so far and Im covering the miles.

The 2.7 is the same engine as the 3.0. and it responds pretty well to some tuning. The 2.7 being detuned so as not to encroach on the 3.0. also with the 3.0 having an auto and 4wd that all saps power - extra weight etc. So keeping it simple and a decent remap makes the difference. Having had a run in a mapped 2.7 I can say that it blew me away at just how different it was in terms of delivery - it felt sharper and more responsive. right across the rev range and it did feel much sweeter aswell.

[adamss24]

^^^ The turbo is very small in the 2.7 and the only reason it feels better than the old 2.5 Tdi is the latest generation turbo which is stretched at 200 Bhp. The 3.0 Tdi has either a bv50 (233Bhp) or a GTB2260Vk (244 Bhp) wich is miles ahead of the 2.7 turbocharger. The 2.7 Tdi feels smooth due to the tiny hotside of the turbocharger but with a remap the EGT increase sharpish. Even the bv50 has trouble with high EGT and the hotside flow much better than the GTB1756vk of the 2.7... The 3.0 tdi has too much torque for FWD that's why it came in quattro guise...If you're worried of a few less MPG then you bought the wrong car with the wrong engine...

[ruggedscot]

I see where you are coming from with this but there are a few things to consider - Looking at running this car to at least 200k - wasnt going to bet against 4wd and an auto so wanted to keep it simple hence wanted 2wd and manual. The 2.7 and 3.0 are from the same engine family and different to the 2.5.

The remap of the 2.7 brings it up to around 225-230 hp. This is bang on the standard output of the 3.0. at 240 hp. The trouble with the 3.0 litre is that it is hampered with ability of the tiptronic handling the torque so this caused issues - the 2.7 was limited and kept a good 40 hp below the 3.0. Ive seen the effect of a good remap and although you say the turbo is limited to around 200 hp the car in question was on a rolling road and graphing over 225 hp. And on the road the car performed well against the 3.0 to the point that it was leading. Yes the bends did allow the 4wd to gain but on the straights there wasnt much in it to be honest.

I know what I would prefer to have and its not an auto !

Like to see the new sequential bi-turbo diesel that is coming out - bet that is awesome to drive. max torque from around 1500 !

[EV2UK]

Thanks guys for some great answers and opinions.

I must say though I did forget to mention in my original post, I defiantly want an auto and from my understanding both the 2.7 & 3.0 come with 4WD as standard with the auto (tiptronic) box.

I'm just worried that the 2.7 might just loose to much power via the auto box and the quattro running gear, I know that the 2.7 can be mapped to 3.0 levels but I've read in a few places that this isn't a good idea.? So my thinking was just to hold out for a 3.0 and leave it standard.


Tony

[lifemoveon]

Hey man,

Not all 2.7 has tiptronic or AWD. Some doesn't.

Personally, I would recommend you to hold out for the 3.0TDI. I have a remapped one and it can really hold its own on the autobahn.

[haysy]

If you want 4WD then the car will either have a manual or a tiptronic box wether its 2.7 or 3.0, but you can have a 2.7 2WD with the multitronic box, which is what I have.
For me it came down to running costs, I wanted a 3.0ltr 06-08, but when I looked into it the tax was about £450 a year for the tiptronic (which about 90% of the cars seemed to be) and I was worried about having to replace 4 tyres at a time due to the 4WD.
I test drove a 2.7 multitronic and loved it!
I ended up buying an 2.7 08 Le Mans Avant with the multitronic box and Im very happy with it.
However if I had the funds I would love a 3.0ltr!!

[adamss24]

Not sure i agree with above.
The 2.7 engine is the newer design like the 3.0.
The old 2.5 was not nearly as good.

I usually go for the 'best' in a range,ie 3.0 but a 2.7 came up that suited my needs so I bought it.I've been really happy so far and enjoy the good mix of performance and economy.

They are both CR engines but that's where the similarities ends. Every other part is different: block, lower compr. pistons, different rods, turbo, injectors, ECU. Map, etc. I would disagree with you in saying the old 2.5 Tdi wasn't as good- it was it's the Longlife servicing which brought such a bad name to it hence the camshaft wear and all. The old v6 got a low pressure old tech turbocharger Gt2052, stick a new bv50, gtb2260vk turbo on it and it feels as good as the 244Bhp 3.0 Tdi with spool-up from 1500 rpm's all on stock hardware. The VP44 can deliver more fuel than the engine can take and there's no major emission malarky as on the CR engine. Add to that the fact that the chain set-up is a rather complicated assembly and most likely requires engine removal in order to replace and you'll see what i mean. I have been running 2.5 v6 tdi's for years now and they go easily to 200k without major problems, i have only seen one or 2 3.0 Tdi going to such high mileage and they were knackered ! Add to the mix the host of electronics the a6 c6 platform have and you'll see what i mean ! I wish to see that multitronic getting to such hich mileage without requiring a gearbox overhaul... Power is easy to extract out of modern engines, it's the gearboxes that cannot cope with the increased torque at such low revs. A 2.5 tdi AKE engine with just aftermarket nozzles and gtb2260vk + remap will easily give a run for the money to any 3.0 tdi or petrol(mapped or not) and that will cost a grand max to tune... Just my 2 penny's worth ...