ZF 6HP19A tiptronic gearbox (A6 3.0 TDI Quattro)

[six_or_out]

Hi folks,

My car has developed an issue with the gearbox - I believe its a ZF 6HP19A. When cold, the car drives perfectly, however after a couple of miles or once warm, there is a judder between 3>4 gears, 4>5 and 5>6 gears. It only does it between 1600>1800 RPM, if I keep the revs higher than that (e.g. in "S"), then it drives fine.

I have scanned it for faults and there are none reported on VCDS.

I booked the car in with the Audi dealership here for diagnostics and they have advised "Gearbox oil change to be carried out + software update of gearbox control unit, reference TPI 2007190/13."

Has anyone else experienced this issue and did the fluid change + software update cure it?
Also, are there any other sources for buying the gearbox fluid or getting the software update other than Audi?
Last question - does anyone have a copy of the TPI they can share?

If I can get the Gearbox fluid, I'm tempted to give it a go myself to change it.

Thanks,

Six.

[apole]

Hi there,

Not the TPI you mention but maybe of some use:

http://uberlame.com/a6_tsb/Transmission/Chirping,%20hooting,%20squeaking%20noise%20when%20 shifting%20between%203-4.pdf

Oil is quite expensive, had mine changed at 40k and it was £26 a litre. Do recall searching on the specification and finding Shell did one for Land Rover for much less. Will see if I can dig that out.

How many miles has your's done out of interest?

[apole]

Found this info:

Audi ATF - Audi Transmission Fluid - G 055 005 A2 - ZF - ATF - 1L (http://www.blauparts.com/proddetail.asp?prod=J1D2110)

or Shell ATF M-1375.4


9 litre capacity, although you won't get all the old stuff out.


From here, but no specific kit or instructions on changing fluid and/or filters.

Audi Automatic Transmission Fluid - How To Change Audi Transmission Fluid (http://www.blauparts.com/audi/audi_fluid/audi_automatic_transmission_fluid.shtml)

[six_or_out]

Thanks Apole,

Car is now on 144,000 miles. The part number I got from Audi for the oil is G 060 162 A2 and they said 7 litres for the change.

Thanks for the links, I'll do some reading this evening and post what I find :D

Did you get the oil changed at Audi or somewhere else?

Six.

[gazza57]

This is an interesting issue, I had an A6 2.7t Biturbo V6 with a tip box and every time I asked about changing gearbox oil I was told they're sealed and should not be touched, mine had done 155k miles
I wish they would just be consistent and tell everybody the same advice

Gazza57

[apole]

Hi,

Had mine done by a local indi.

Agree on the differing advice, I decided to get mine done every 40k for peace of mind.

[gupsterg]

Hi six_or_out,

I had my tiprtonic oil changed when chains where done... I was advised software update to gearbox would be done... but not done :(, its only a revision number lower but the part no for software match the fixed one in TSB/TPI..

I looked at an updated version of above TSB/TPI Andy has linked and was able to ref software part no/revision/gearbox serial number to satisfy my mind that all is well, if you would like it PM an external email... last time Audi printed it off for me as well...

My personal view currently due to if done wrongly gearbox damage can occur I would go dealer route, Yes initially I had issues with my main dealer but then slowly came around to keeping me sweet & at least you will have some kind of recourse if the worst happen... A mate of mine had his chains done at a main dealer they somehow got something wrong with gearbox refit and damage occured, they gave him a new one FOC :)...

Hi Gazz57... some info concerning tiptronic oil here Link:- Second Hand A6 (http://www.vwaudiforum.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?138145-Second-Hand-A6&p=752725#post752725)

It seems most enthusiasts are doing it every xx,000 miles, ZF also recommend it :) ...

Mine felt alot better after oil change, this hill I regularly go up in cruise before change 3rd gear after change 4th....

ATB
Gup

[gupsterg]

Vehicle type
Engine
Gearbox
ECU
Gearbox code
SW Part No. (new)
Version (SVM)
SVM code


A6 (C6)
3.0 l TDI
19.04
GZW
4F0910156H
0110
4F02A007 / NA4F37AA01


A6 (C6)
3.0 l TDI
19.11
HXN
4F1910156S
0030
4F02A007


A6 (C6)
3.0 l TDI
19.11
HKG
4F1910156B
0050
4F02A009



My VCDS Log...
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 02: Auto Trans Labels: 09L-927-760.lbl
Part No SW: 4F1 910 156 B HW: 09L 927 156 A
Component: AG6 09L 3.0lTDI RdW 0030
Revision: --H01--- Serial number: 4005962
Coding: 0000001
Shop #: WSC 02325 785 00200
VCID: 234FC467E2C232001CE

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

So my revision is low, going by info below I should have blue ATF so if Dialynx filled it with that all AOK... if not then :( ...
Now he advised he would be able to do this update on collection he said sorry our kit can not perform update, due to other issues with the work I just walked away :( ...

Production change

1. Optimised ATF (blue) from February 2005 (gearbox numbers A: 4000597, B:95253).


2. Optimised ATF (green) from March 2008

(gearbox number: A4, A6, A8: 4432890, Q7: 4040037)


Looking at the VCDS section you've PM'd your in the same boat as me... your part no is relevant... but revision is lower... so as TPI suggest fill with newer oil (green) the software must be updated as per TPI...

So yours going by SW P/N must be a GZW transmission?

I would seriously go with dealer... it may cost the extra £££ but at least you will have peace of mind/support from them IMO...

I wouldn't wanna pay for a transmission on one of these :Blush2:....

[six_or_out]

Hi Gup,

thanks for the information above, I think the gearbox in my car has the "yellow" fluid (ZF lifeguard6, Audi G 055005 A1/A2/A6), so I'm thinking if I replace it with like for like, I won't have to do the software update. It's also A LOT cheaper...

I've purchased the oil and will be getting it changed shortly.... let's see what happens :o

Six.

[apole]

Hey Six,

Maybe a bit late, but I was doing some research at the weekend and found some more info on the oil.

The tiptronic gearbox oil in our cars I believe is the same as Ravenol 6HP. Conforms to the spec I have written down. Now last year I paid my indi £26 a litre, found this:

http://www.blauparts.com/proddetail....d=J1D2110%2D12 (http://www.blauparts.com/proddetail.asp?prod=J1D2110%2D12)

http://www.ravenol.de/en/produkte/ve...6hp-fluid.html (http://www.ravenol.de/en/produkte/verwendung/d/Product/show/p/ravenol-atf-6hp-fluid.html)

and available here:

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/AUDI-AUTO-...item3a768c5a9d (http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/AUDI-AUTO-GEARBOX-6-SPEED-ZF-TRANSMISSION-FLUID-RAVENOL-6HP-7-LITERS-/251097012893?pt=UK_Vehicle_Oils_Lubricants_Fluids&hash=item3a768c5a9d)

Somewhat cheaper, but I think you need to have at least 8 litres to hand to be on the safe side.

I'd also be looking to take the sump off and checking for sludge and if there are any magnets that could need cleaning up, so add in a new gasket.

Let us know how you get on and if you don't mind if you agree this oil and spec is correct for next time.

[six_or_out]

Hi Apole,

Thanks for the links - I saw those and I was considering buying the Ravenol Oil from here: RAVENOL ATF 6HP Fluid, 4 Liter - Detailed item view - RAVENOL UK Online Shop (http://ravenol-shop.co.uk/shop/article_2111124/RAVENOL-ATF-6HP-Fluid%2C-4-Liter.html?sessid=DhYWDCeKK8T32l0h4UlLNCgOsuAuGphJ nM0fdVAXf4eeevKmteituNS3SSJtFk1P&shop_param=cid%3D73%26aid%3D2111124%26)

I however managed to find this one for less and it is the one I've bought:http://www.febi.com/fileadmin/user_upload/febi/england/downloads/febi_fluids_brochure_GB_internet.pd (http://www.febi.com/fileadmin/user_upload/febi/england/downloads/febi_fluids_brochure_GB_internet.pdf)f
(Number 43 in the brochure)

I'll let you know how it goes. I think I'll do a fluid change initially and see if it makes any difference to the gearbox, if it does (for the better) I'll do a full change with the filter. If not, I think I'll be looking at a gearbox rebuild or torque converter issue...

Six.

[apole]

Hey Six,

Just found this whilst trying to find the TPI gup kindly listed.

ZF 6HP19 - 6HP28 Transmission Failures Due To Bad Valve Body and Computer Programming Information | PRLog (http://www.prlog.org/11758814-zf-6hp19-6hp28-transmission-failures-due-to-bad-valve-body-and-computer-programming-information.html)

So, with that in mind, although my car is working very well I'm tempted now to get the software updated, cheaper than the potential alternative.

[six_or_out]

Thanks Apole, just had a read of that website, it doesn't sound good....

On a side note, visited another Audi dealer to buy a new washer/bolt for the gearbox for when the oil is changed and they told me they have never changed the oil on a tiptronic box and don't know how to do it....they also gave the sealed for life message and asked why I wanted to change the oil.

Six.

[apole]

Well you don't know if you have that issue, plenty of cars on here going strong after lots of miles, just worth knowing about.

Found similar with advice on things, depends who you speak to as knowledge varies and people assume things.

Good luck and keep us posted.

[Allroad_anth]

Try looking for an auto transmission specialist in your area. You will probably find that they follow ZF guidelines which will recommend a change at 80 ish. Audi have decided on the sealed for life bit. My dealer does know how to change and is happy to do so for a fee.
if your box had a leak they would have to change...

[gupsterg]

Cheers Andy & six_or_out on the info/updates http://yoursmiles.org/bsmile/fun/b0220.gif...

I thought I'd analyse my own car's past photos/logs further...

So below the gearbox is a plate...

http://i1247.photobucket.com/albums/gg629/gupsterg/2_7%203_0%20TDi%20stuff/MyA6Avant212_zps405a205a.jpg

Zoom shot...

http://i1247.photobucket.com/albums/gg629/gupsterg/2_7%203_0%20TDi%20stuff/MyGearboxIDplate_zpse4dc1e07.jpg

1 Serial number of gearbox
2 Model number
3 Gearbox designation
4 Code letters

Next info from my VCDS log... (full version here Link:- Post 8 (http://www.vwaudiforum.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?141671-ZF-6HP19A-tiptronic-gearbox-%28A6-3-0-TDI-Quattro%29&p=777828#post777828))

Part No SW: 4F1 910 156 B Revision No SW: 0030 Serial number: 4005962

My gearbox serial number 4005962, besides plate it is in VCDS log blue text...
Next TPI/TSB relevant bits to me (underlined)...


Production change

1. Optimised ATF (blue) from February 2005 (gearbox numbers A: 4000597, B:95253).

2. Optimised ATF (green) from March 2008 (gearbox number: A4, A6, A8: 4432890, Q7: 4040037)

Measure

Case A: vehicles before chassis break:

On MY 05 vehicles and earlier (before gearbox number: A:4000597, B:95253) update the software of the gearbox control unit.
Note: The new ATF needs the software version. Failing to update the software will lead to gearbox damage.

Case B: vehicles after chassis break:

Vehicles after the chassis break have optimised oil and the suitable software version in the gearbox.

My car is "Case B"... the serial number of the gearbox places it into this category...

In above both cases G 060 162 A (green) oil is used as update in TPI instructions...

(In parts cat. G 060 162 A2 (green) is £32 per L, G 055 162 A2 (blue) is £32 per L)

But both blue & green are "Optimised ATF"... :confused: ... then I cross ref'd this older US version of the TPI...

Link:- TSB File (http://uberlame.com/a6_tsb/Transmission/Chirping,%20hooting,%20squeaking%20noise%20when%20 shifting%20between%203-4.pdf)

It is so similar but for the US petrol cars... extracts below which interested me...


Production Solution

Optimized ATF (Blue) from gearbox numbers 4000597 and 95253

Required Parts and Tools



Part Number
Part Description
Quantity


G 055162A2
ATF (blue)
16




The US TSB have release date of 07 Dec 06...

TPI 2007190/11 have release date of 11 Aug 08...

TPI 2007190/13 have release date of 18 Jan 10... Link:- Russia Audi Forum Post (http://www.audi-club.ru/forum/showpost.php?p=5645640&postcount=229)

So the suggestion of oil ie blue or green depend on TPI age, so my view is that green superseded blue but both blue & green are "Optimised ATF" what was not "Optimised ATF" was whatever was used before that in MY05 (2004)/ gearbox numbers lower than: A:4000597, B:95253...

Now my P/N for gearbox software is correct it is only rev which is low, mine 0030, TPI=0050...
Now this section is my research to ease my mind that the rev of SW in my gearbox doe not matter...


Case A: vehicles before chassis break:

On MY 05 vehicles and earlier (before gearbox number: A:4000597, B:95253) update the software of the gearbox control unit.

Note: The new ATF needs the software version. Failing to update the software will lead to gearbox
damage.

1. Update the software of the gearbox control unit (see table under Parts information)


As my car case B not A no SW update http://yoursmiles.org/bsmile/fun/b0202.gif...

Now the rev of software is different in table because it is an updated software at time of TPI just like the oils (blue/green)...

http://yoursmiles.org/bsmile/fun/b0221.gif...

So after all this if I have a gearbox issue I must first ref...


The converter condition can be checked in MVB 007/3 (converter open/ converter control/ converter shut).


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gpMloZuyWYk

More info on video in this post... Link:- A6 3.0 TDI QUATTRO numbers - Page 4 (http://www.vwaudiforum.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?139736-A6-3-0-TDI-QUATTRO-numbers&p=781203#post781203)


I'll let you know how it goes. I think I'll do a fluid change initially and see if it makes any difference to the gearbox, if it does (for the better) I'll do a full change with the filter. If not, I think I'll be looking at a gearbox rebuild or torque converter issue...


Ref your gearbox serial to TPI then you'll know if SW need update or not... next I would do MVBs via VCDS... then perhaps oil change/get advise from a ZF specialist...

If IIRC Crasher has done rebuilds on these and ZF office is close to his workshop...

[six_or_out]

Hi guys,

I had the gearbox oil changed a couple of weeks back (using the oil I posted earlier so there was no need for the software update). They could only change 3.5 litres as that's all that came out of the sump when they drained it. The car feels at least 50% better since the change. Gear changes are smoother and the judder is much less pronounced than previously. I've ordered a new filter & gasket for the gearbox and this time I will be changing it myself over the easter break. I'll let you know how it turns out...

Six.

[gupsterg]

As you know I had oil change on gearbox done when chain rattle was fixed, I didn't see process due to the relationship deteriorating between me and Dialynx...

Today I was going over this thread Link:- Tiptronic oil change ! (http://www.vwaudiforum.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?127011-Tiptronic-oil-change-)!

Now in that it seems oil change require more litres than you've used and Andy are you able to share how much was used in yours?

On my invoice for Dialynx some things are not clearly priced as it was for the whole job of chain rattle fix,etc so no idea on how much oil used...

[apole]

Hey Gup,

I had mine done soon after getting the car. The indi misquoted me at £150 not realising it was quattro and as such different box, more expensive oil etc. He charged me for 6 litres, but he did knock a bit off the cost due to misquoting so it's possible it took a bit more. At the time it was £26 a litre plus VAT. Didn't know them well enough to ask at that stage about if the filter should be replaced, what the old oil looked like etc. I think they just drained oil and refilled with fresh.

3.5 litres seems small to me, I know you can't get it all out but I'd expect more than that.

Six, how you planning on DIY, are you just doing fluid or you going to do the filter and clean magnets and sump pan?

Do you have a tool to refill the fluid? I was thinking of something like this:

MERCURY MARINER MERCRUISER GEAR LUBE OIL PUMP - FITS ALL QUART / 1 LITRE BOTTLES | eBay (http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/181014983454?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1423.l2649)

Then putting some bent over copper pipe in the end to replicate the official tool.

Would probably go to a boat shop to see what this kind of pump is like, or could end up taking hours to refill if the pump is tiny !!

Be interested in how you get on.

[gupsterg]

Hi ya Andy :) ...

I'd found a document showing how you can tell health of tranny from oil colour/particles on magnets but seem to have lost it :Blush2: ...

I found this though as well Link:- Audi Tiptronic Install.pdf (http://bd8ba3c866c8cbc330ab-7b26c6f3e01bf511d4da3315c66902d6.r6.cf1.rackcdn.co m/AudiTiptronicInstall.pdf)

Now on page 7 step 14 of linked guide its says "This is the initial fill, and commonly consumes 2-4 quarts, depending on transmission size and total capacity." which equals 2.2-4.5 Litres... then engine started and filling resumed (engine still running) steps 15-16 ... this is same method as how TSB/TPI says...

Is this how yours was done? I never got the chance to see mine being done/ask fully :Blush2: ...

Now in VAG TPI/TSB they suggest "Change the ATF twice (1 x flushing and 1 x changing)." for issue gearbox but do you think this would be best practise even for oils changes to get better result?

TIA
G

[apole]

Hey Gup,

Thanks for the info.

Didn't get to watch mine being done - pretty sure it was just the fluid and no sump off/new filter etc which is a shame. Also with all the info you have found, also not sure what of the two oil types was used so danger like you I've got a mix. It took them a while and for some of it the engine was running and ramp went up and down so assuming they did it the phased way to ensure level is correct.

Saying that box works very well.

Funnily enough I saw a wheeler dealer episode the other night where they did an oil and filter change in a tiptronic boxter s. Again a multi stage refill, initial pump in oil until it seeps out fill hole, then run engine to get oil up to a temp range, put thro gears, and fill again until it seeps out. Reckon that can't be a million miles away from what the audi one needs.

A while back I had concerns over auto box on another motor. Specialist told me to take a sampe of oil and put on a clean white kitchen tissue, it then spreads out and you can see if particles in it and what residue/colour is left.

Thinking if I can work out what oil type mine needs based on above info, may change oil, filter and gasket etc myself using friends ramp later this year to be sure job done properly with correct oil. Also be able to see oil colour and if anything horrid lurking on magnets etc. Depends on time and how brave I'm feeling !

[apole]

Hey Gup,

Just read the guide in your link, very clear guide, thanks for finding that. Exactly what they did on TV other night bar temp was much higher on other car and they used laser thermometer.

Thanks again, doesn't look too bad a job, bar the smell of the oil :D

[gupsterg]

That guide is on an A6 4F :)... they do show the oil sump for A6 & A4...

So much better than the service guide :) , seeing the process in technicolour makes me also very tempted to do it when needed again on mine myself using the ramp@my friendly indi workshop...

I'll fish out the P/N for all relevant parts/seals,etc...

[_Tazman_]

Having done this job myself on my A6, it's a piece of cake, same as my Merc.

Don't bother with the updated fluids ( which is lifeguard 8, unless you REALLY get all of the old fluid out, the software update is a bodge, as it kind of tells the g/box to slip the tranny / brake bands more / less ).

All the A6s were filled with ZF lifeguard 6, stick to this & ONLY ZF fluid & you will be fine.

Mine was the original fill, yellow lifeguard 6, and it's readily available ( I think I used a well know retailer up north ), I did the pan, sump filter & flushed the torque converter & full refill, then top up at the correct temp.

My box just turned 48k, so the fluid that came out was definitely a bit worn & WELL worth doing. No real sludge, but certainly signs of wear / grey slime on the filter body.

When the weather is better, i'll do the direct shift box & the other bit.

It can be a bit messy & you MUST have the car level, but it's certainly do-able ( oddly enough the BM 5 series use the same box, but they use a throwaway pan assembly which has an intergrated filter ).

I would suggest that there is NO SUCH thing as oil 4 life..... this will certainly require a new AT in the future.

cheers :D

[gupsterg]

WOW great info & share on experience :beerchug: I bow to your DIYNESS :notworthy...

IIRC recently I was going through the ZF website and they have an online catalogue with info about tranny/oil...

I've also seen that some of the parts like the magnets are available directly from them but not Audi dealer...

[_Tazman_]

I've even got the full ZF part list for the 6HP19 box, can e-mail you as a pdf if you want ?

Only use Lifeguard 6 fluid & you won't go wrong. :D

[gupsterg]

I'll just PM you my external email :) ...

Thanks :fing02:...

[gianton]

I've even got the full ZF part list for the 6HP19 box, can e-mail you as a pdf if you want ?

Only use Lifeguard 6 fluid & you won't go wrong. :D

Hi,

Could you please PM me the list with ZF parts and the site where can I buy them?

[techfreak]

Having done this job myself on my A6, it's a piece of cake, same as my Merc.

Don't bother with the updated fluids ( which is lifeguard 8, unless you REALLY get all of the old fluid out, the software update is a bodge, as it kind of tells the g/box to slip the tranny / brake bands more / less ).

All the A6s were filled with ZF lifeguard 6, stick to this & ONLY ZF fluid & you will be fine.

Mine was the original fill, yellow lifeguard 6, and it's readily available ( I think I used a well know retailer up north ), I did the pan, sump filter & flushed the torque converter & full refill, then top up at the correct temp.

My box just turned 48k, so the fluid that came out was definitely a bit worn & WELL worth doing. No real sludge, but certainly signs of wear / grey slime on the filter body.

When the weather is better, i'll do the direct shift box & the other bit.

It can be a bit messy & you MUST have the car level, but it's certainly do-able ( oddly enough the BM 5 series use the same box, but they use a throwaway pan assembly which has an intergrated filter ).

I would suggest that there is NO SUCH thing as oil 4 life..... this will certainly require a new AT in the future.

cheers :D

Hi Tazman,

Can you confirm where you/how you came to this conclusion?

The TSB confirms the update is needed and I've read threads on this from forums all over the world - everyone who's had the issues and done the upgrade both software and oil have stated noticeable improvements.

I'm not doubting if your solution works, as it obviously has for you, but you're the only person to say this and I'm thinking wouldn't just changing the old oil for the same version old oil only delay the inevitable?

[MarkTM]

Tech
Mt tuppence worth.

I think what Taz is saying is unless you get all of the lifeguard6 out, then flush with lifeguard 8, then refill with lieguard 8 it's pointless doing the software upgrade.

So unless the specialist has the facilities to pump all of the lifeguard 6 out...or at least 90% of it then it's best to stick to Lifeguard 6 as it will be cheaper.

Which is what the ZF specialist that's doing mine said, there's nothing actually wrong with lifeguard6 or the box. I think that ZF recommend the new fluid with the new software....appreciate that we live in changing times!

The 6 is for sale on special here, where coincidentally are a ZF specialist and are doing my transmission fluid and filter:

ZF Lifeguard 6, Shell M 1375.4,Transmission Fluid, ATF, (http://www.bristoltransmissions.co.uk/shop/product.php?id_product=64)

They recommended NOT having the upgrade and that I continue to use Lifeguard 6, if I have the upgrade I'll be stuck using expensive 8:

Incidentally Audi's new 8 speed box is made by whom:confused:

Then 'Hey! Why don't we modify our 6 speed box to use the higher priced 8 speed box fluid...there aren't many alternatives out there and we'll have a captive market once they upgrade...all we need to do is make some mods to the 6 speed box and we've guaranteed greater future profits!'

This made a good read!

Who has changed Transmission fluid on 6Automatic Quattro? [Archive] - Audizine Forums (http://www.audizine.com/forum/archive/index.php/t-515380.htm)

[MarkTM]

Here's a find

Millers Automatic Transmission and Power Steering Fluid DM 5lt | eBay (http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Millers-Automatic-Transmission-and-Power-Steering-Fluid-DM-5lt-/271136873283?pt=UK_Car_Accessories_Car_Care_Cleani ng&hash=item3f21045b43)

Meets ZF ATF M1375.4 which I believe is the standard of our tranny fluid? £5.80 per liter delivered?!!

[gupsterg]

The software update is only applicable to very early gearboxes ...

Audi's TSB does also highlight changing oil twice with new oil ...

[MarkTM]

Weird as they told me there was an update for mine too:confused: Does that mean mine can take Lifeguard 8 as is?

Well that's not a problem with the cheapy oil I posted but the cost of Audi fluid makes it prohibitive for many...but of course great for Audi! :biglaugh:

[gupsterg]

If a person who thinks TSB is applicable to them and goes to Audi dealer they can check on their system via your VIN if it apply...

Link:- Post 16 (http://www.vwaudiforum.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?141671-ZF-6HP19A-tiptronic-gearbox-%28A6-3-0-TDI-Quattro%29&p=786001#post786001) contains a rather in depth breakdown of the TSB...


what was not "Optimised ATF" was whatever was used before that in MY05 (2004)/ gearbox numbers lower than: A:4000597, B:95253...

There are two versions of how the serial number will be on plate/VCDS log... A:4000597orB:95253

If your serial is lower then update software & oil is done@Audi ... if your serial is higher then only oil changed@Audi ...

Again this my understanding of looking at this and structure of other TSB's... if issue persists then they would do further investigation...


Weird as they told me there was an update for mine toohttp://www.vwaudiforum.co.uk/forum/images/smilies/confused.png

Sorry can not comment on this, I only know of this TSB and information contained in it... was it Audi who advise you on update software?

[MarkTM]

Thanks again Gup for the clarification.

No not Audi but ZF specialist, I would think it's ZF that tell Audi when an update is available and probs takes a few months before it gets approval & down to dealers.

[gupsterg]

Thanks for share :beerchug:... a member who posts less on here had oil changed at a ZF workshop they did 1x fill of new for flushing out old then they did 1x new fill of oil but they wouldn't do update and advised go to Audi for flash update of TCM ...

TCM software/revision after SVM action@Audi is same as latest advised in the TSB/TPI being discussed in this thread...

The member has an Avant 3.0 TDi engine code: BMK trans. code: HKG prod.date: 25/05/2005

Address 02: Auto Trans Labels: 09L-927-760.lbl
Part No SW: 4F1 910 156 B HW: 09L 927 156 A
Component: AG6 09L 3,0 TDI RdW 0050
Revision: --H01--- Serial number: 4032248

Mine is an Avant 3.0 TDi engine code: BMK trans. code: HKG prod.date: 07/03/2005

Address 02: Auto Trans Labels: 09L-927-760.lbl
Part No SW: 4F1 910 156 B HW: 09L 927 156 A
Component: AG6 09L 3.0lTDI RdW 0030
Revision: --H01--- Serial number: 4005962

Red is software part no in TCM
Green is software revision in TCM
Blue is serial number of gearbox

Be great to see what flash update P/N & revision they do for you :) ...

[_Tazman_]

soz, not had a chance to check in on this thread.

Basically I trawled a LOT OF Other forums ( some info MUST be taken with a pinch of salt ). Then I contacted the local ZF dealer whom retails the actual fluid.

Basically & from my own engineering experience & that of the service manual ( SSP for the box ). The 1st & 1st thing it says is DO NOT MIX the ATF fluid with any other.

Lifeguard 6, is aptly named for the 6 sp, then you have 7, 7+, and now the 8.

All are slightly different, I assume due to churn & shear resistance ( a LOT of moving bits in there ! ).

The engineering justification is very simple. It was the factory fill fluid, that has already done 46k, suffice to say, in this time it would have failed / had problems by now with changes etc.

All that Audi ( and remember that MOST of the dealers, my local one near me too ) don't even nationally acknowledge the exchange of fluid. what this tells you is that their advice is HIT & MISS. If however you speak to a ZF distributor / service dept, they will ADVISE you to leave as is. Afterall, they make the box, NOT AUDI. This is the SAME box supplied to BMW, I know as my mate has a 535d & I'm going to do his ATF fluid soon.

As I said, the Software update is a bodge, as it tells the ECU that the fluid has a different friction co-effiecient. But & this is the thing, most Audi dealers only do a 30% change, that is some just dump the fluid, and don't even change the filter etc..

Hence, how do you KNOW what the fluid composition is now ? If you ask ZF the question, they may say it's possible to mix, but wouldn't advise, else you would just have one brand of Lifeguard.

Use ZF6 on the A6 3.0tdi & you won't go wrong.

I personally would never dream of taking my car to a dealer for such a simple task as a fluid change. But that's just me. I do appreciate, some don't have the time, facilities / may have the confidence to work on a car ( and there's nowt wrong with that ).

BUT, be careful with your choice as if done wrongly WILL cause you to need a new AT. The only benefit of using a *******, is that you have a warranty, thus if they bugger it up, it's ok.

I would suggest that you ask them to just use the factory fill fluid ( IMHO ) :D

[_Tazman_]

just reminded me, a mate on another forum actually is a development engineer for ZF, I'm gonna PM him & see what he has to say.

Adds more info to make an informed decision :D

[gupsterg]

Lifeguard 6, is aptly named for the 6 sp, then you have 7, 7+, and now the 8.

All are slightly different, I assume due to churn & shear resistance ( a LOT of moving bits in there ! ).

From discussions with another member this is the reason for the software update that the genuine Audi green/blue ATF differ in properties thus the update for older transmissions...


All that Audi ( and remember that MOST of the dealers, my local one near me too ) don't even nationally acknowledge the exchange of fluid. what this tells you is that their advice is HIT & MISS.

The TSB/TPI is created elsewhere within VAG IMO ... probably from data supplied by warranty work done in dealers... for example as this TSB relates to early transmissions they must have been sending info/failed transmission back to VAG to then make production changes ... which company wants loads of warranty claims?


If however you speak to a ZF distributor / service dept, they will ADVISE you to leave as is.

This is the advise given to me when had fluid change but no software update done... at that time I really did not understand the TSB fully and felt workshop was misleading me :Blush2: ...

If you have no issues and are just changing oil like for like is the best IMO... plus adaptation drive should be considered as well Link:- Tiptronic oil change ! - Page 2 (http://www.vwaudiforum.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?127011-Tiptronic-oil-change-!&p=684374#post684374)

[techfreak]

Thanks for replying taz this and what gups is saying makes sense...

Anyone know if A8 Tech is about? Maybe he can shed some light on the subject?

I'm tempted to just do the oil change and leave the rest well alone.

[apole]

Agree with the above. I've looked at this before and spoken in length with others including Gup.

I just had my fluid changed when I bought the car at 40k. Will be sticking with oil changes at 30-40k intervals and only using lifeguard 6 fluid. There are others that meet the spec including Shell, Ravenol etc. Some seem far cheaper, but is it worth mixing them?

Out of interest Gup found a good UK supplier, Bristol Transmissions, they do just the fluid for a good price, or a complete change kit (less the tools to refill).

Heres a link for more info:

http://www.bristoltransmissions.co.uk/shop/product.php?id_product=25 (http://www.bristoltransmissions.co.uk/shop/product.php?id_product=25)

　

Be interested in what ZF have to say on the matter, but can't see that regular changes with the correct fluid can do any harm if they are done from the outset.

[gupsterg]

ZF do recommend/have oil change kits... Link:- ZF Parts | oil change kits (http://www.zf.com/brands/content/en/zf_parts/products_zfparts/oil_changing/oil_changing_kit.html)

So I'm assuming what is at question is the software update?

[techfreak]

ZF do recommend/have oil change kits... Link:- ZF Parts | oil change kits (http://www.zf.com/brands/content/en/zf_parts/products_zfparts/oil_changing/oil_changing_kit.html)

So I'm assuming what is at question is the software update?

My understanding from what taz said is it only needs updating if you manage to fully update your oil from old to new I.e 6 to 8.

If not then only oil needs changing and other consumables can anyone clarify what these are i.e. filter/gasket? Edit: I think I've answered this looking at the above links.

My only question then would be how often should we do this? I'm guessing every 40k is ok but maybe less if you drive the car quite hard more often than not?

[gupsterg]

My understanding from what taz said is it only needs updating if you manage to fully update your oil from old to new I.e 6 to 8.

The TSB/TPI only relates to genuine Audi oil ...

So does anyone know what ZF Lifeguard / equivalent is the genuine oils G 060 162 A2 (green) & G 055 162 A2 (blue)?

[MarkTM]

My understanding from what taz said is it only needs updating if you manage to fully update your oil from old to new I.e 6 to 8.

If not then only oil needs changing and other consumables can anyone clarify what these are i.e. filter/gasket? Edit: I think I've answered this looking at the above links.

My only question then would be how often should we do this? I'm guessing every 40k is ok but maybe less if you drive the car quite hard more often than not?

Change more often if

1) You tow (greater strain)
2) If your engine has ever overheated (cooked ATF)

If neither AND taking into account the 80k warranty/sealed for life issue 40k may be a little too soon for a Tip, am going to get mine done now (88k) and every 50k henceforth.

Weird that the ZF kit is this price from Bristol transmissions as they quoted me £272.40 inc VAT to do the work...but then there is labour involved.

They shall be doing mine and I've asked them to:

a) Let me take pics
b) Have a sample of the oil to send away for analysis to Blackstone for analysis*

They were a little surprised as have never been asked for a sample of the old fluid before! :p

* Blackstone Labs (http://www.blackstone-labs.com/)

[techfreak]

Change more often if

1) You tow (greater strain)
2) If your engine has ever overheated (cooked ATF)

If neither AND taking into account the 80k warranty/sealed for life issue 40k may be a little too soon for a Tip, am going to get mine done now (88k) and every 50k henceforth.

Weird that the ZF kit is this price from Bristol transmissions as they quoted me £272.40 inc VAT to do the work...but then there is labour involved.

They shall be doing mine and I've asked them to:

a) Let me take pics
b) Have a sample of the oil to send away for analysis to Blackstone for analysis*

They were a little surprised as have never been asked for a sample of the old fluid before! :p

* Blackstone Labs (http://www.blackstone-labs.com/)

Thanks for clarifying.

That's a good price I'd say then.

Anyone know what the difference is between what apole posted and this kit:-

ZF Life, Shell M 1375.4,Transmission Fluid, ATF,ZF 6 sump/filter assm (http://www.bristoltransmissions.co.uk/shop/product.php?id_product=12)

@gups I assumed the oil what Audi use is the zf oil rebranded?

[gupsterg]

@gups I assumed the oil what Audi use is the zf oil rebranded?

Why I asked question...


So does anyone know what ZF Lifeguard / equivalent is the genuine oils G 060 162 A2 (green) & G 055 162 A2 (blue)?

Is that if we are studying TSB/SSP we can see there where three oils used in production...


Production change

1. Optimised ATF (blue) from February 2005


2. Optimised ATF (green) from March 2008


The third was what was used before Feb 2005 (older transmission serial) that would need the software update...
@Mark be great if you could also get a software log of TCM before/after work and will eagerly be awaiting your experience share :beerchug: ...

[_Tazman_]

Pic of the sump when removed ( note the clean wipe mark on the filter based ).

203612036220363

I also took a pic of my ATF pumping system. Remember, keep it simple !! Plus you can also measure what you take out with what you put in !

Cleanliness IS VERY IMPORTANT.

HTH :D

[MarkTM]

Taz what mileage did you have on yours and was it its first ever change (to your knowledge)?

Regardless it all looks pretty clean...was there much crud or fluid discolouration?

[_Tazman_]

Mark, I did my change at about 48K.

This is definitely the 1st ever change it has had, there was nothing else in the service history, apart from that crappy long life stamp !

They never even changed the diesel filters ( I know, as I did it, and 3 out of the 6 glow plugs were O/C ).

Audi servicing my **** !

It wasn't too bad the residue, typical clutch band wear & some fine particles, but no alarming chunks / slivers of metal. Definitely worth doing. The oil whilst being a bit dirty, was still yellowish.

:D

[MarkTM]

They never even changed the diesel filters ( I know, as I did it, and 3 out of the 6 glow plugs were O/C ).

Audi servicing my **** !

:D

Taz appreciate there are those that won't have anyone but Audi even change their wiper blades!:p

[gupsterg]

It wasn't too bad the residue, typical clutch band wear & some fine particles, but no alarming chunks / slivers of metal.

What you are saying there is exactly what the workshop that did mine iterated to me... they added that you'd only find more metal/bad oil if transmission has been suffereing from problems...

They also said if there is no issue with how the transmission work then an oil change service suffices for most preventative/servicing point of view...

[techfreak]

Ok I'd like to get this done as my car is on 99k miles and have no idea if this was ever done - i doubt it!

and i'd like to possibly attempt it myself - have access to ramp so that should make life a bit easier.

Can anyone please tell me what parts I'd need to get and which is the correct kit from Bristol transmissions, also are there any special tools required?

[gianton]

Pic of the sump when removed ( note the clean wipe mark on the filter based ).

203612036220363

I also took a pic of my ATF pumping system. Remember, keep it simple !! Plus you can also measure what you take out with what you put in !

Cleanliness IS VERY IMPORTANT.

HTH :D

When Audi dealer had mine done, they said that they don't take out all the fluid but only about half of it. How did you manage to take out all of it? Could you please post a step by step guide?
Thanks in advance.

[apole]

Hi,

As with most automatic boxes, you can never get all of the fluid out, much will remain in the pump and other workings. When I had mine done at an indi, they only got 5 litres out. I've seen some specialist companies have a special tool that is almost like a dialysis machine, it connects to the oil cooler pipework then circulates clean fluid through until it keeps coming out clean.

As you can't easily replace all the fluid, that is why I intend to change mine fairly regularly, say around 40k, just to keep a fresh mix going through, and to keep an eye on the condition of the stuff coming out, and build up if any on the magnets.

Mark, if you are using Bristol transmissions, maybe worth asking if they are just taking out what they can or using a flushing machine to ensure all the oil is replaced? I'd be more interested in the latter and to be fair the £250ish they quoted is a good price if that is a flush and filter change.

[Cwizard]

Found this http://www.zf.com/na/content/media/united_states/corporate_replacement_parts_1/service_portfolio/passenger_cars/6HP19A_Catalog.pdf

The more info the merrier...

Also, what would be the torque rating for this tranny? I've been searching all around and cant find any info.

[gupsterg]

Great link my friend :beerchug: ...

From SSP 325 ...


The new 6-gear multi-step automatic transmission 09L is used for all automatic transmission versions with quattro drive. It is based on the 6-gear automatic transmission generation 09E, which was introduced in the Audi A8´03. A torque capacity of up to 450 Nm means that it can be combined with the new 3.0 l V6 TDI. This gearbox was first used in the Audi S4 sports model.

The 09L is designed for the
following engines:
– 3.0 l V6 TDI CR
– 3.2 l V6 FSI
– 4.2 l V8 MPI

[techfreak]

Don't know what happened meant to link this post here:-

Tiptronic oil change ! (http://www.vwaudiforum.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?t=127011)

[gupsterg]

Today I was going over this thread Link:- Tiptronic oil change ! (http://www.vwaudiforum.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?127011-Tiptronic-oil-change-)!

From post 18 (http://www.vwaudiforum.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?141671-ZF-6HP19A-tiptronic-gearbox-%28A6-3-0-TDI-Quattro%29&p=792681#post792681) of this thread :nana: ...

[techfreak]

From post 18 (http://www.vwaudiforum.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?141671-ZF-6HP19A-tiptronic-gearbox-%28A6-3-0-TDI-Quattro%29&p=792681#post792681) of this thread :nana: ...

Oops I missed it... :-P

[gupsterg]

Only tugging your keyboard :p ... otherwise it gets so grey & boring hey! LOL

[_Tazman_]

Gianton et al, all I did to do the full exchange is to undo one of the hoses to the atf cooler at the radiator, then aim it into a bucket.

Simply refit the sump with new filter, then fill to the brim ( just note down how much you shove it, i think it's about 2.5 litres ), then turn on the engine, the pump will flush the ol fluid out fo the open hose & then stop the engine as the flow begins to slow ( DO NOT continue to run the engine ).

Then repeat until all the old crap is out.

Then it's a case of reconnecitng the cooler line, and refill then do the final top up with the car running & at the correct temp ( can't remember, but I'm sure 45-50deg comes to mind.... or whaterver ElsaWin says ).

Job done :D :beerchug:

righto' , off to the pub in this sun !

[gianton]

Gianton et al, all I did to do the full exchange is to undo one of the hoses to the atf cooler at the radiator, then aim it into a bucket.

Simply refit the sump with new filter, then fill to the brim ( just note down how much you shove it, i think it's about 2.5 litres ), then turn on the engine, the pump will flush the ol fluid out fo the open hose & then stop the engine as the flow begins to slow ( DO NOT continue to run the engine ).

Then repeat until all the old crap is out.

Then it's a case of reconnecitng the cooler line, and refill then do the final top up with the car running & at the correct temp ( can't remember, but I'm sure 45-50deg comes to mind.... or whaterver ElsaWin says ).

Job done :D :beerchug:

righto' , off to the pub in this sun !

Thanks mate, I'll pass this to my indi and hope he can work things out. Otherwise he will take out the half of the fluid as the AD did 50k km ago.

[gupsterg]

I found this though as well Link:- Audi Tiptronic Install.pdf (http://bd8ba3c866c8cbc330ab-7b26c6f3e01bf511d4da3315c66902d6.r6.cf1.rackcdn.co m/AudiTiptronicInstall.pdf)

Now on page 7 step 14 of linked guide its says "This is the initial fill, and commonly consumes 2-4 quarts, depending on transmission size and total capacity." which equals 2.2-4.5 Litres... then engine started and filling resumed (engine still running) steps 15-16 ... this is same method as how TSB/TPI says...

The link to the PDF is broken in Link:- post 20 (http://www.vwaudiforum.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?141671-ZF-6HP19A-tiptronic-gearbox-%28A6-3-0-TDI-Quattro%29&p=793501#post793501) of this thread... I have created this Link:- Audi Tiptronic Install.pdf (https://docs.google.com/file/d/0B6ybetYJ0wwMbnVydlpQMDZNYlk/edit?usp=sharing)

[MarkTM]

Other ZF threads on other forums I've read indicate that it's unwise to flush the torque convertor out as any particles in there are actually beneficial...dunno how true that is? So the initial change should improve the quality of your tranny fluid by 60%+ and another change will improve that to above 85%

When I get my fluid/filter done at Bristol Transmissions am going to see how much they'll charge just for a fluid change in 5k miles or so. ;)

[Cwizard]

Contacted my local Audi service centre they told me 9 litres of oil required for the tranny oil change+new sump+filter. More than $2200. Does that sound about right? Or is it fairy tales for 9 litres being changed?

[daveplyjeep]

Hi.

Not read all the posts but just changed my gearbox oil and without dropping the filter got 4 liters in max.

Dave

[gianton]

Contacted my local Audi service centre they told me 9 litres of oil required for the tranny oil change+new sump+filter. More than $2200. Does that sound about right? Or is it fairy tales for 9 litres being changed?

I will be having for the 2nd time the gearbox oil changed. First time with the filter changed it took about 6 liters in total.

Just ordered from the local ZF centre the filter set cost is €93 euro. Oil needed is around 6 liters cost is €25 euro per liter for the ZF Lifeguard 6 and €8 euro per liter for the Ravenol 6HP19. I will go for the Ravenol oil and total will be €93 (filter set)+€48 (oil)+€50 (labour work)= €191 euro work will be done in a local Audi dealer.

I think you're overcharged.

[MarkTM]

9 liters cannot be changed unless they are using a machine to suck the fluid out of the torque convertor..so confirm with your dealer if they are

a) dropping the pan and changing fluid - 6 liters
b) purging/replacing the fluid with a suction/pumping device - 9 liters

As this thread has stated the norm is around 6 liters since few dealers use the suction method on transmissions in the UK

[MarkTM]

PS: Check how much with a ZF specialist, in Melbourne I believe it's

J Pringle Automotive 27-35 Leveson St Nth Melbourne, 9329 9260

Google is my friend!

[Cwizard]

Is that official service provider from ZF or just general tranny indie?
Thanks a lot for your help.

[MarkTM]

^^^ Why don't you ring and ask them? :p They should have their ZF certification on the wall as my place did when I had mine done yesterday

Only know as they are popular with the Range Rover fraternity in Melbourne which have......drum-roll please.....ZF gearboxes!

My fluid and filter change went well yesterday, no deposits or metal shards to be found...the replacement fluid was slightly opake (not quite transparent) the old oil was completely black I mean you put it in a plastic container and you can see through it (will post a pic when I can) Not that black transmission fluid is a bad thing (as black oil isn't) am still glad to get it out though!.

They quoted me 1hrs labour and the fluid for the next change in 5k miles, then I'll be doing it every 30k miles thereafter.

It was hunting a little on the drive home but seems fine this morn...am guessing it was just the box/convertor getting used to the higher quality fluid mix...seems fine today and changes up/down far more seamlessly than before :biglaugh:

Will be sending the old tranny fluid away for analysis on Tuesday.

[Cwizard]

I thought you somehow (using google?) you got a fair bit of info on them. ill be sure to give them a call. I can imagine my oil change with 140.000km on the clock. I don't think i have any problems with it... we'll see what they say.

[MarkTM]

Nope you shouldn't mine had 90,000 miles/145,000km and no problems to report.

If you have any oil analysis places in Oz may be worth saving some of what comes out and sending it off to see the state of it.

Good luck! :D

[gupsterg]

So post 20 has the ECS doc on oil change ...

Here is a Official ZF Parts catalogue with some info on oil changes pages 5- 9 this also has info on the front diff/rear torsen diff of gearbox Link:- ZF 6HP19A (https://docs.google.com/file/d/0B6ybetYJ0wwMOXBOcEpNSVFNblk/edit?usp=sharing)

Here is a Link:- Automatic Choice LTD catalogue (https://docs.google.com/file/d/0B6ybetYJ0wwMcEdibmFLNC03TW8/edit?usp=sharing)

Link:- LifeGuard Fluid PDF (https://docs.google.com/file/d/0B6ybetYJ0wwMUFFvLTVsRExCUjg/edit?usp=sharing) Link:- Ravenoil 6HP Fluid (https://docs.google.com/file/d/0B6ybetYJ0wwMQmpjTUNjWnRpWlk/edit?usp=sharing)


Technical data



Service code
09L


ZF code
6HP-19A


Audi code
AL 420 6Q


Gearbox type

6-gear planetary transmission (multi-step automatic transmission), electronically controlled with hydro-dynamic torque converter with slip-controlled torque converter lockup clutch




Control
Mechatronic (integration of the hydraulic control unit and electric control to form one unit)

Dynamic switching programme with a separate sport programme "S" and the Tiptronic switching programme for manual gear change


Torque converter
W255 RH-4 GWK


Power transmission
Permanent four-wheel drive "quattro" with Torsen central differential


ATF
9.0 litre G 055 005 (Shell ATF M-1375.4)
Lifetime fill


Differential, FA/RA
1.1 litre/0.5 litre
G 052 145 (Burmah SAF-AG4 1016)
Lifetime fill


Weight including oil in kg
Approx. 115 kg


Max. torque in Nm
Up to 450 Nm, depending on engine version


Kingpin inclination
6.04




Above from SSP 325 page 80 (googles search for it) ...

So perhaps for a fuller service the gearbox diff oils should also be considered?

[techfreak]

Out of interest I asked my local dealer how much it would cost to do this and the software upgrade. They couldn't tell me straight away as it's not on the computer...

Anyway they got back to me with this:

Transmission fluid = 9ltrs = £246.33+vat

O ring =£1.84+vat

sealing plug = £9.24

labour 0.9 = £108.00

Total price = £438.50inc

[gupsterg]

Out of interest I asked my local dealer how much it would cost to do this and the software upgrade.

Does yours need the upgrade? ref the serial number in the VCDS log/plate on gearbox ...


before gearbox number: A:4000597, B:95253 update the software of the gearbox control unit

There are two serial number styles ... A or B if your serial is higher then TPI/TSB suggest no software update just oil change ...

[MarkTM]

Tech, so your dealer has the ability and will suck out all of the old fluid including that in the torque converter and that's what they intend to do on your car?

If sucking out/pumping through they'll get the 9lt out but I'd defo be asking them...since just pulling the plug and then refilling is about 6lt

Weird also that they aren't pricing you for a new tranny filter and gasket set...my advice would be to get these changed as well.

[techfreak]

Does yours need the upgrade? ref the serial number in the VCDS log/plate on gearbox ...



There are two serial number styles ... A or B if your serial is higher then TPI/TSB suggest no software update just oil change ...

I think it would need it according to this:-

Address 02: Auto Trans Labels: 09L-927-760.lbl
Part No SW: 4F0 910 156 H HW: 09L 927 156
Component: AG6 09L 3.0lTDI RdW 0080
Revision: --H01--- Serial number: 0040400
Coding: 0000001
Shop #: WSC 02335 785 00200
VCID: 2855E6799BE83A9

[techfreak]

Tech, so your dealer has the ability and will suck out all of the old fluid including that in the torque converter and that's what they intend to do on your car?

If sucking out/pumping through they'll get the 9lt out but I'd defo be asking them...since just pulling the plug and then refilling is about 6lt

Weird also that they aren't pricing you for a new tranny filter and gasket set...my advice would be to get these changed as well.

Good point, I would assume they have the ability to do the full 9ltr change but will confirm and will question the lack of the filter/gasket set in that price.

I'd also like to know if they'll clean out the sump properly inc the magnets.

[gupsterg]

I think it would need it according to this:-

Address 02: Auto Trans Labels: 09L-927-760.lbl
Part No SW: 4F0 910 156 H HW: 09L 927 156
Component: AG6 09L 3.0lTDI RdW 0080
Revision: --H01--- Serial number: 0040400
Coding: 0000001
Shop #: WSC 02335 785 00200
VCID: 2855E6799BE83A9

I would draw that opinion as well ...



Vehicle
type

Engine
Gearbox
ECU
Gearbox
code
SW Part No.
(new)
Version
(SVM)
SVM code


A6 (C6)
3.0 l TDI
19.04
GZW
4F0 910 156 H
0110
4F02A007 / NA4F37AA01



If dealer used SVM code in green text in above table you would get the update via VAS machine ...

Can you confirm your trans code as GZW?

Your model year (MY) must be 2004/2005 I'm guessing as low serial on gearbox?

[ukgroucho]

Out of interest I asked my local dealer how much it would cost to do this and the software upgrade. They couldn't tell me straight away as it's not on the computer...

Anyway they got back to me with this:

Transmission fluid = 9ltrs = £246.33+vat

O ring =£1.84+vat

sealing plug = £9.24

labour 0.9 = £108.00

Total price = £438.50inc

I think I paid nearer £500 when I had mine done last year (2005 3.0 TDi Tip) - but not sure if they flushed and also replaced the additional filters etc. referenced. Car had done mid 70k miles and I was seeing similar symptoms to the OP. When the car was properly warm on a warm day changes between 3rd 4th 5th were a little 'harsh'... it was quite subtle but you just KNOW when it is not 'right'.

My recollection is that my dealer stated that they had found a relevant service note that actually called for an oil change to a slightly different oil - not sure if that is correct. They also stated that they updated the gearbox firmware.

It DOES behave differently now - from cold it holds slightly higher RPM before it will change up, just for the first few miles (presumably until the oil warms up). After 2 or 3 miles it settles into what I consider to be 'normal' behavior and changes are the usual smooth shifts that you would expect.

The whole sealed for life thing is complete BS in my opinion - although if the gearbox fails at 150k with the original oil in it then I guess it WAS sealed for life.

The consensus from what I read (as I was trying to work out what to do) was that an oil change around 70k is adviseable.

[techfreak]

I would draw that opinion as well ...



Vehicle
type

Engine
Gearbox
ECU
Gearbox
code
SW Part No.
(new)
Version
(SVM)
SVM code


A6 (C6)
3.0 l TDI
19.04
GZW
4F0 910 156 H
0110
4F02A007 / NA4F37AA01



If dealer used SVM code in green text in above table you would get the update via VAS machine ...

Can you confirm your trans code as GZW?

Your model year (MY) must be 2004/2005 I'm guessing as low serial on gearbox?

Yes early model 17/06/2005. Trans code is on green plate right? I'll check but I'm guessing you are correct.

[gupsterg]

Yes early model 17/06/2005.

Is this production date or first registration?


Trans code is on green plate right? I'll check but I'm guessing you are correct.

Besides plate on gearbox your data sticker in spare wheel well / service log will have info ...

http://i1247.photobucket.com/albums/gg629/gupsterg/2_7%203_0%20TDi%20stuff/Transcode_zps20f3cfe5.jpg

Red Box is gearbox code, blue is the rear drive code ...

[techfreak]

Is this production date or first registration?



Besides plate on gearbox your data sticker in spare wheel well / service log will have info ...

http://i1247.photobucket.com/albums/gg629/gupsterg/2_7%203_0%20TDi%20stuff/Transcode_zps20f3cfe5.jpg

Red Box is gearbox code, blue is the rear drive code ...

Ah that's first registration and it is GSZ.

Where would I find production date?

[Guest 2]

If you look on your data sticker again, you will see a production date in MM/YY format.

Pic 1 has it above the gearbox code - 02/09

http://i816.photobucket.com/albums/zz90/57_audi/A3/scan00032_zpsf2820c7c.jpg

Pic 2 has it again, above the gearbox code - 12/07

http://i816.photobucket.com/albums/zz90/57_audi/iPhone%20Uploads/972cd1e2.jpg

[techfreak]

I knew I should have just taken a pic of it lol thanks Chris

[gupsterg]

Ah that's first registration and it is GSZ.

GSZ is your rear drive ... what does it say to the right of it like in my pic?

[gupsterg]

Today I found the document I had seen before and misplaced :D ...

So VAG guidance on assessment of wear by checking ATF for colour and contamination is:-

Colour of ATF

Colour yellow or blue: ATF is new.
Colour brown: ATF is used (approx. 60,000 km upwards)
Colour black: one of the gearbox components is defective (e.g. overheating of torque converter lock-up clutch, burnt out clutch linings).

Note:- On vehicles with TDI engines, the ATF turns black after approx. 60,000 km without the gearbox being defective.

ATF contains metal particles

Wear is within normal range if metal particles on magnet in oil pan or in ATF are smaller than 0.1 mm Ø and quantity is not more than 1 cm3.

Metal particles larger than 2.0 mm Ø on magnet in oil pan or in ATF indicate abnormal wear or a mechanical fault in the gearbox.

Procedure if ATF is contaminated

ATF very contaminated (ATF black or metal particles in ATF):

Dismantle and clean complete gearbox.
Flush ATF galleries and blow through with compressed air.
Dismantle and check all clutches.
Renew torque converter (cannot be cleaned).
Renew mechatronic unit (cannot be cleaned).
Clean ATF lines and ATF cooler and renew ATF strainer.

[daveplyjeep]

Think that written off about 75% of all gearboxes.

Sent from my RM-825_eu_euro1_217 using Tapatalk

[gupsterg]

Lol!

[Happybiker]

So I've read the many threads on tip gearbox oil changes and having just bought a 08 3.0tdi with 100k miles and no history of a gearbox oil change I was thinking of getting the oil done. I've found the oil from Bristol Transmissions and a local transmission specialist in Chelmsford will drain the oil and refill for £60. Is it worth doing this now and again in a few months or should I get the whole kit and drop the pan and do the filter?

[MarkTM]

To change the fluid I thought you have to drop the pan anyway?

As have said previously in this post I think I paid £270+VAT for Bristol Transmissions to do it including fluid and filter....a bit of a long way for you to travel.

Appreciate that they'll only get 75% of the fluid out, so my plan is to get another fluid change (but not the filter) in the spring, which should mean that the fluid is 95+% replaced, for this Bristol Tranny's quoted me I think £150+VAT

[Guest 2]

So I've read the many threads on tip gearbox oil changes and having just bought a 08 3.0tdi with 100k miles and no history of a gearbox oil change I was thinking of getting the oil done. I've found the oil from Bristol Transmissions and a local transmission specialist in Chelmsford will drain the oil and refill for £60. Is it worth doing this now and again in a few months or should I get the whole kit and drop the pan and do the filter?

Change the filter and the oil. It would be odd not to and just like not changing an oil filter when doing the engine oil.

[Happybiker]

I think you can get about a gallon of oil out with the sump fitted. I know doing the filter and oil makes sense, I'll see if they'll do that for me.

[apole]

Hi,

If you can I'd change the filter too, I paid £32 for the kit plus the oil from Bristol. Gives you a chance to see how dirty it all is, and what is in the pan and on the magnets. Later on I'd just do another oil change on it's own as you can never change all the oil.

I'd call Bristol up as with me they checked what I needed.

[furfurfur]

I know this has been discussed on the forum at length - actually that's part of the problem, there seems to be so many ways of doing things and different opinions, I now don't have a clue what to do!

My 6 speed tiptronic box is allegedly sealed for life, but I wouldn't mind getting the oil changed now after 110k miles, as it just seems like a good idea. However, I have rung around and had 3 very different quotes -

1. Local Audi specialist (Dialynx) - £130 + VAT (or thereabouts, forgot the exact figure). They are using genuine Audi oil and say it will take them about half an hour to do.

2. Bristol Transmissions - £300 + VAT. This includes the oil and filter and they'd need the car for "most of the day".

3. Gloucester Rd. Gearboxes - £100 + VAT plus Oil for something called a Megaflush. Filters are not renewed. They have looked up my gearbox and say that for a megaflush, 17 litres of oil is required, coming to a total of around £589 + VAT including the labour.

There is of course option 4 - leave it the hell alone as it's "sealed for life" - £0 !

At this point I totally at a loss as to what to do and will probably leave it, but any advice would be welcome...

[Guest 2]

Have you seen this DIY Tiptonic Oil and Filter Change 3.2 FSI Quattro (http://www.vwaudiforum.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?151502-DIY-Tiptonic-Oil-and-Filter-Change-3-2-FSI-Quattro)

[Sam]

No doubt you've seen this thread already - Tiptronic oil change ! (http://www.vwaudiforum.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?127011-Tiptronic-oil-change-!) - but I'd go with the word of a8 tech every time.

(EDIT: That's one for the How To section Chris - assuming it's all correct of course?)

[Guest 2]

(EDIT: That's one for the How To section Chris - assuming it's all correct of course?)

You're asking me if a guide on a gearbox oil change is correct .. Whatever next?! ;)

But yes, Jon is correct and your first quote seems too good to be true given the price of the official fluid/L

[furfurfur]

No doubt you've seen this thread already - Tiptronic oil change ! (http://www.vwaudiforum.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?127011-Tiptronic-oil-change-!)

Yup, been doing a lot of reading, perhaps too much. I just wish Audi went ahead and made it a 80,000 mile service item, then everyone would know what's up!


Have you seen this DIY Tiptonic Oil and Filter Change 3.2 FSI Quattro (http://www.vwaudiforum.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?151502-DIY-Tiptonic-Oil-and-Filter-Change-3-2-FSI-Quattro)

Yup, that's really interesting! Unfortunately whilst I'm pretty happy doing engine oil changes I wouldn't feel comfortable doing a gearbox oil change at home, never done one and it's not something I'd want to mess up - plus my driveway may not be flat enough.

I suspect Dialynx's quote is based on only replacing 3-4 litres of the oil, and certainly not the filters. I could ask them. I may also ask how much it would be to get the filter changed too.

As always I would like to strike a nice balance between cost and reward. I think paying £720 for a full system flush when I'm not experiencing any issue with the car is a bit much :)

[daveplyjeep]

Hi .

Go with the first one, given the price of zf filud. But ask how much to change the filter. Then if still a good price get it in writing.

Dave

[Guest 2]

I'll be getting Audi to do mine now in 2k when its due a service at 92k.

Will report back with prices when done.

[Sam]

You're asking me if a guide on a gearbox oil change is correct .. Whatever next?! ;)

Must have banged my head on my week off ;)

[Guest 2]

Must have banged my head on my week off ;)

Didn't even notice you were gone! :p

[furfurfur]

Have you seen this DIY Tiptonic Oil and Filter Change 3.2 FSI Quattro (http://www.vwaudiforum.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?151502-DIY-Tiptonic-Oil-and-Filter-Change-3-2-FSI-Quattro)

OK, so DIY looks pretty interesting. I am not sure what ATF I should be using, though. It's all rather confusing - I've read the threads with gupster's research and still none the wiser. My gearbox details are:

Address 02: Auto Trans Labels: 09L-927-760.lbl
Part No SW: 4F2 910 156 T HW: 09L 927 156 C
Component: AG6 09L 3,0 TDI RdW 0020
Revision: --H04--- Serial number: 4402665
Coding: 0000001
Shop #: WSC 02325 785 00200
VCID: 3669DDA5415C5C9

I think this means my gearbox should have ZF LifeGuard 6+ in it, seems hard to find though, and some places suggest 6+ has been superceded by 8. Can I mix the two in the gearbox? It looks like the DIY method won't drain it all out only about 50% of the oil.

[apole]

Hi there,

Option 1 is too cheap - genuine audi oil £32 +VAT a litre round my parts, you need 4-5 ...... Also gearbox oil has to be at 40C temp wise, from experience the oil after driving is much higher than that and takes a long time to cool down so they would need car for longer to allow it to cool properly. PM gup as well as he had a bad experience with someone local to him.

Option 2 - not sure, wasn't happy with their recommended aftermarket oil, would deffo go for lifeguard 6 which will put their price up a bit but Mark speaks well of the work they did for him.

Option 3 - again dunno tbh, sounds overkill.

For me if you are in doubt use either Audi or lifeguard 6 oil.

Also my oil was pretty clean and I don't notice any difference in how car drives so in hindsight probably overkill to change in my case.

If anyone spots any errors in my DIY guide please do speak up, intention is to help others so any mistakes would be good to see. Did alot of research in ZF and Audi tech guides beforehand mind.

Remember (as I should !!) sometimes the best thing is to do nothing for the time being, if it works ....... :D

[apole]

Hey guys,

One more thing. Notice A8 says 8 litres if oil pan off. I didn't get this much out, after draining the sump, there was a bit more in the sump pan and some in the filter. Other members here also found same and when I paid to have it done couple of years back they only charged me for 5 Litres.

In my research found a Sonnax guide on this gearbox:
http://www.sonnax.com/system/pdfs/375/original/2011_Presentation_AutoChoice.pdf

Page 28 shows refill is 4.2 litres.

Not saying 8 litres is wrong, just I didn't get this much out so if anyone knows why the difference I'd be grateful.

[Carboncobra]

Just had my multitronic oil changed today at my local independent Audi specialist. 7 litres at £12 a litre. An hours labour at £40 plus VAT. Total £148.80.

[furfurfur]

Just had my multitronic oil changed today at my local independent Audi specialist. 7 litres at £12 a litre. An hours labour at £40 plus VAT. Total £148.80.

Tiptronic is different to multitronic. Your gearbox oil is a scheduled service item unlike in the tiptronic.

[furfurfur]

Remember (as I should !!) sometimes the best thing is to do nothing for the time being, if it works ....... :D

I'm starting to think that's the best thing to do for now. I have 0 problems with my 'box and as they saying goes, if it aint broke... :)

[furfurfur]

In my research found a Sonnax guide on this gearbox:
http://www.sonnax.com/system/pdfs/375/original/2011_Presentation_AutoChoice.pdf

Page 28 shows refill is 4.2 litres.

Not saying 8 litres is wrong, just I didn't get this much out so if anyone knows why the difference I'd be grateful.

Suspect 8 liters includes all the oil hiding in the gearbox that you can't get out, and would be the initial fill, however they do that.

[MarkTM]

When Bristol transmissions drained my tip box they got out just over 7l, they only charged me for 7 though, capacity is 10 or 11 but there's 2-3l hiding in your torque convertor....so my change was circa 70% and when I get the fluid alone done early next year it will mean that my oil will be 95%+ renewed

[daveplyjeep]

After been given more info. I would not touch op 1 with a barge pole.
Dave

Sent from my RM-825_eu_euro1_217 using Tapatalk

[jubbly]

I believe they messed Gup around a lot with his car.

[MurrayN]

Good morning! A newbie dropping in with similar gearbox issues on my 3ltr A4. (Judders between 1400\1800 rpm when hot.)
After having been through this thread, I'm looking for confirmation on what gearbox oil I can use in my car.
My car was manufactured in MY 12\04 and has a gearbox code of GCX. Sorry I've not got the serial numbers etc off the box itself.

From what I have read, if I go to Audi they will use the most up to date oil they use and I will need a software update to go with it, also I'll need a small mortgage for the price of oil haha!
So from reading here, can I use Audi oil G055 005 A2? Or ZF lifeguard 6. I can find these 2 types of oils no problem. The only thing I can't figure out is will I need a software update to go with any of these oils?

Any help is much appreciated.

Cheers Murray

[daveplyjeep]

Hi Murray.I think your questions are answered in this thread. I contacted Bristol transmissions and they supplied the correct oil and filter and gasket. Not the Audi or zf oil. As for the software update. I can't see what difference that will make to the oil. The gearbox is still the same, it's just a bit of fine tuning as far as I can see.I am now ready for the stream of rebuffs from all, and by the way "Happy new year to all".Dave

[MurrayN]

Dave, thanks for the reply. Yeah I'm sure I could use either, I was just looking for clarification on the software update. I don't fancy replacing the box if it goes pear shaped
My next port of call was Bristol transmission's tomorrow morning, and I'll no doubt order a "kit" from them.

Cheers Murray

[MurrayN]

Just thought i would reply back with the outcome with my gearbox.
I phoned up Bristol tranmissions Monday morning, spoke to a very helpful man and ordered there gearbox oil change kit.
It arrived on Wednesday and had the oil and filter changed yesterday.
The box is now super smooth, unbelievable what difference it has made, and my box had only done 66K!

Now just needs a remap next month as a treat:D

Murray

[gianton]

Just thought i would reply back with the outcome with my gearbox.
I phoned up Bristol tranmissions Monday morning, spoke to a very helpful man and ordered there gearbox oil change kit.
It arrived on Wednesday and had the oil and filter changed yesterday.
The box is now super smooth, unbelievable what difference it has made, and my box had only done 66K!

Now just needs a remap next month as a treat:D

Murray

Which oil they used?

[MarkTM]

Perhaps this kit? They used this one on mine:

ZF6HP19 Fluid Filter Change Kit - Bristol Transmissions Ltd (http://www.bristoltransmissions.co.uk/shop/product.php?id_product=25)

They used the pentasin fluid on mine and no problems



ZF Lifeguard 6, Shell M 1375.4,Transmission Fluid, ATF, (http://www.bristoltransmissions.co.uk/shop/product.php?id_product=88)

[MurrayN]

Which oil they used?

There own oil. Doesnt have a number or a name, buts they said its pretty much the same as ZF lifeguard 6.

Murray

[funavant]

Hi guys, I may be trying to wake up a dead thread, but I've found a interesting web page with what looks like exact description of the OP original problem.

AGCO Automotive Repair Service - Baton Rouge, LA - Detailed Auto Topics - What is Torque Converter Shudder (http://www.agcoauto.com/content/news/p2_articleid/203)

Here the vibrations are reported as torque converter shudder with a very detailed description of possible cause and way to fix it. Worth reading.
Interesting point is re-tightening the valve body bolts while doing the ATF change.
I may give it a go, i.e. ask my indie to re-tighten the valve body when doing the next ATF change. As OP's car, mine had developed the same kind of shudder which was mended by ATF change. However, the shudder eventually came back after about 7-8000miles, not as bad as it used to be, so next ATF change is on the cards, this time with re-tightening the valve body bolts and replacing the ATF cooler pipes due to surface corrosion (just in case).

Have a look at the web, see what you think.

[MarkTM]

Interesting point is re-tightening the valve body bolts while doing the ATF change.
I may give it a go, i.e. ask my indie to re-tighten the valve body when doing the next ATF change.

Mine's had a fluid/filter change at 86k miles and is having another fluid change in few months, any idea what the torque settings should be?

[funavant]

I am just checking ElsaWin copy on my computer, so give me few minutes.

[funavant]

Here you are Mark:





Tighten securing bolts -1- and -2- for mechatronic unit to 2 Nm.




–
Then tighten retaining bolts to 8 Nm in specified sequence -1 ... 11-.



That's what ElsaWin says about my car (A6 Avant LeMans, 3.0TDI, 2008).

[Sam]

VW Audi Forum - "Copyright" (http://www.vwaudiforum.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?115425-VW-Audi-Forum-quot-Copyright-quot)

I've had to remove the ESLAWin image from the above post.

If you must share it, please do so off the forum. Petty I know, but I quite like VWAF and I want it to remain open and free for all.

[MarkTM]

Appreciated Fun, pretty low torque then!

Am guessing it's easy to access once tranny sump dropped?

[funavant]

Mark, it should be accessible right after you drop the sump and remove the strainer.
Sorry about the picture had to be removed,if you need it, PM me and I'll send it to you.
I would just ask the guy working on my tranny to set the torque to 8Nm and go round the bolts and see what happens, if the bolts would turn at all. The idea is that the gasket perishes over time and may get thinner compared to when new, therefore not sealing properly and causing cross leak. If you think about it, it does make sense because when there is a small cross leak the tranny cannot apply enough pressure to the lock up clutch (when in low rpm) and that's where you can feel shudder.
So re-tightening should make the mechatronic (valvebody) unit to sit tightly, preventing cross leak and allow to build up enough pressure for the lock up clutch.

[Audi?]

Hi all,

Is it actually possible to do this job without raising the car on a lift? My Car a May 2005 3.0TDI Quattro tip avant, seems to be too low to get underneath it!

[Guest 2]

seems to be too low to get underneath it!

This.

[Audi?]

great thanks

[funavant]

Bear in mind that the car has to be perfectly level to fill the box with new ATF. So a garage with well installed lift/ramp is necessity.

[funavant]

OK guys, now my tranny has had a second ATF change, so I can report how it's been so far.

My second gearbox service was done in May 2014, together with valvebody bolts re-tightening and what a change! The tranny has been shudder free ever since and it is still performing flawlessly. Just to remind you, I had been suffering from torque converter shudder which went away after the first ATF change done in October 2013. Then eventually shudder came back, so I decided to have another ATF change together with valvebody bolts re-tightening. I was personally present in the garage when the guy re-tightened the bolts and it looked like they (the bolts) did not move at all (the torque was set to 8Nm). But when the tranny servicing was finished I noticed that shudder was gone straight away (it wasn't so after the first ATF change-it took several miles of driving before shudder disappeared). So it does make a sense to repeat the ATF change, if the issue with torque converter shudder is not resolved after first attempt. More info here: AGCO Automotive Repair Service - Baton Rouge, LA - Detailed Auto Topics - What is Torque Converter Shudder (http://www.agcoauto.com/content/news/p2_articleid/203)

Hope you guys find this post helpful!

[MarkTM]

Which garage did you use?

[funavant]

All Audi in Brislington, Bristol. Nice guys, always helpful, highly recommended.
If you are going to use them, just tell them Martin with 3.0TDI A6 estate with autobox recommended them to you, they'll remember. I was basically stood under the car with a copy from ElsaWin (to have the exact sequence of re-tightening the bolts) while the guy did the bolts. I am not sure whether re-tightening made the difference but the box felt like new after that second servicing. Mind, they didn't change the strainer, only ATF and bolts re-tightening.

[MarkTM]

Thanks Martin :biglaugh:

And the cost broken down for fluid and labour?

Mark

[funavant]

Mark, PM sent

[Guest 2]

Have mine booked for Tuesday 5th with my local specialist, maybe a bit overdue at 107k but better late than never :o

Major service this Monday so it'll be a treat for it.

[MarkTM]

Chris, you going to ensure they do the Elsawin recommended tightening sequence?

Anyone car to share what this is without breaching copyright? :)

Am assuming this shown in point 4 is the method:

http://www.zf.com/brands/content/en/zf_parts/technology_in_practice_zp/oil_change_procedure_zp/how-to-change-oil.html

Google can be my friend too! :biglaugh:

[Guest 2]

He's a ex VW Master Tech for 14 years so I'm more than sure he'll follow everything by the book. :)

Funny thing is he's my best buddy's cousin so he could've came in very handy a while back if I'd knew who he was!

[MarkTM]

VW master tech or not, I'd imagine something (what appears to be as complex) as the tightening sequence will be forgotten without reference material, even by those that do it every day! Coupled with the fact that less than 15% or cars are automatic in the UK :)

[Guest 2]

I'll trust him on this one, he always has Elsa open and uses it for the simplest of things even as adjusting my door when it dropped slightly.

I'll just give him the parts, leave the car and drive his 6R Polo GTI for the day :o

[funavant]

Exactly as Mark said, plus I don't think garages normally check the valvebody bolts when doing autobox ATF change. And when you see an autobox without sump, you realize how difficult it is to follow exact tightening sequence. There are just too many bolts!

[gupsterg]

1. Local Audi specialist (Dialynx) - £130 + VAT (or thereabouts, forgot the exact figure). They are using genuine Audi oil and say it will take them about half an hour to do.

Came across this thread whilst doing some googling, perhaps I shouldn't post i) old thread ii) as that experience is something which I'd rather forget

Genuine to me means VAG stamp, not what I discovered on my oil filter when they had swapped it, Link:- Why can't people do what they say? (http://www.vwaudiforum.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?149355-Why-can-t-people-do-what-they-say)

Now rather than go into a long winded post please PM me for info/photos why option 1 is defo not an option!


but I'd go with the word of a8 tech every time.

So would I :) only prob is every garage has not got someone as skilled as him!, so many times when I've asked for x at x place and A8 Techs instructions presented they think you've just landed from another planet!


OK, so DIY looks pretty interesting. I am not sure what ATF I should be using, though. It's all rather confusing - I've read the threads with gupster's research and still none the wiser. My gearbox details are:

Address 02: Auto Trans Labels: 09L-927-760.lbl
Part No SW: 4F2 910 156 T HW: 09L 927 156 C
Component: AG6 09L 3,0 TDI RdW 0020
Revision: --H04--- Serial number: 4402665
Coding: 0000001
Shop #: WSC 02325 785 00200
VCID: 3669DDA5415C5C9

I think this means my gearbox should have ZF LifeGuard 6+ in it, seems hard to find though, and some places suggest 6+ has been superceded by 8. Can I mix the two in the gearbox? It looks like the DIY method won't drain it all out only about 50% of the oil.

Your gearbox serial is lower than 4432890 but higher than 4000597 so using that info Audi ATF blue is what yours would have IMO. In the TSB/TPI there is mention of SW update in TCM and yours wouldn't need it due to it's serial. In TSB/TPI and when talking to a fellow owner who had his transmission oil change at a ZF workshop in europe they use first fill to do flushing of old/new then second fill as final.

G 055005 A? (yellow) = ZF LifeGuard 6 approx from production dates 2004 IMO Link:- G-055-005 - Synthetic Oil Europe (http://syntheticoil-europe.eu/231-g-055-005-a1-a2-a6#)

G 055162 A? ATF (blue) = ZF LifeGuard 6+ (From February 2005 production) Link:- G-055-162 - Synthetic Oil Europe (http://syntheticoil-europe.eu/229-g-055-162-a1-g-055-162-a2-g-055-162-a6)

G 060162 A? ATF (green) = ZF LifeGuard 8 (From March 2008 production) Link:- G-060-162 - Synthetic Oil Europe (http://syntheticoil-europe.eu/230-g-060-162-a1-g-060-162-a2-g-060-162-a6)

Be aware this is info I have gathered for my own purposes from various sources (VAG/ZF Tech docs, etc) and have no professional qualification/experience related to VAG :o .

[Guest 2]

All ready for tomorrow :)

http://i816.photobucket.com/albums/zz90/57_audi/A6/6768ea7e-2638-4cff-8175-72ec6a5e0b87_zps6a477818.jpg

[MarkTM]

Mine used 7.25l when the fluid and filter was changed, you seem to have 6l?

Unless you're hiding a bottle?

Let us know if you notice a difference once/if he tightens the valvebody bolts.

[Guest 2]

Thats what Bristol Transmissions sent me, just 6L.

[gianton]

Mine used 5,5 L with filter both times I had it changed.

[MarkTM]

OK, hopefully not an issue if more is needed the person doing the job will have some spare.

Posts 4 & 10 recommend between 7-7l, and Bristol who did mine used 7.25l

[Guest 2]

If he needs more I'm sure VW will have some in stock, they're only 10 mins away so don't mind going down :o

Did you notice any difference when you had yours done?

[Guest 2]

It seems Bristol has left me up a certain creek without a paddle.

They have sent me the wrong strainer/filter, the cylindrical tube is too short and will not go into the gearbox. 1-2cm shorter than the original.

They're closed obviously now and I'm guessing by the time I send it back and get another in return it'll be Thurs/Fri before I get another, to make things worse TPS don't have any in stock as it's a special order item.

So the car can't be started as he can't put the new oil in without the strainer and he can't really pump the old fluid back in as that would just be silly so the car had to be pushed out (up a hill!) and parked until I get another filter. :zx11:

My guy did take some pictures as I asked him this morning. Obviously these are just after the fluid drain and nothing had been cleaned/prepped yet.

Think I'll be buying parts direct from Audi from now on instead of sourcing them through another company.

http://i816.photobucket.com/albums/zz90/57_audi/A6/IMG_5675_zps6aceca78.jpg

http://i816.photobucket.com/albums/zz90/57_audi/A6/IMG_5676_zps1dbbe04a.jpg

http://i816.photobucket.com/albums/zz90/57_audi/A6/IMG_5677_zps5914bce9.jpg

http://i816.photobucket.com/albums/zz90/57_audi/A6/IMG_5682_zps35de4496.jpg

http://i816.photobucket.com/albums/zz90/57_audi/A6/IMG_5684_zps663832c5.jpg

[gupsterg]

Nice pics :) , shame about strainer :( ...

[Guest 2]

Everyone makes mistakes but a bit disappointed to be honest!!

[gianton]

Nice pics @A6_Chris, really a shame about wrong part.

BTW which bolts need tightening?

[MarkTM]

That is sad, did you place your order on a Friday? :(

Of course they'll be collecting at their cost and crediting you, plus perhaps a little extra for the inconvenience.

I think you'll find that the car the filter does fit takes a max of 6l of fluid.

[Guest 2]

Order was placed on Thursday morning, dispatched Thursday afternoon and arrived yesterday AM.

On the plus side I have his little Polo GTI home which is a little pocket rocket plus it has a stage 1 Revo map so its very sharp.

If it needs more than 6L I'll cry!

[MarkTM]

There's your answer...get them to provide you with lots of free fluid which you can keep for the next time! :)

[Guest 2]

Hopefully by the time it's due another change I'll be in a A3 Saloon or A4 Avant!

[Guest 2]

Hats off to TPS, they saved the day! They sorted me a strainer this afternoon somehow. Had to collect it but that wasn't a problem.

Fluid filled, adaption drive done and I'm a happy bunny.

The gearbox took 5.75L which relieved the stress a bit!

Now just Bristol to sort out tomorrow re refund!

http://i816.photobucket.com/albums/zz90/57_audi/A6/strainer_zps9fad3a76.jpeg

[gianton]

Hats off to TPS, they saved the day! They sorted me a strainer this afternoon somehow. Had to collect it but that wasn't a problem.

Fluid filled, adaption drive done and I'm a happy bunny.

The gearbox took 5.75L which relieved the stress a bit!

Now just Bristol to sort out tomorrow re refund!

http://i816.photobucket.com/albums/zz90/57_audi/A6/strainer_zps9fad3a76.jpeg

Glad all sorted in the end. Did they tighten the bolts?

[Guest 2]

Glad all sorted in the end. Did they tighten the bolts?

All tightened in the sequence given in ELSA and all torqued to 7nm :D

[gianton]

All tightened in the sequence given in ELSA and all torqued to 7nm :D

How does it feel now? Do you still have this kick when downshifting in S from 3rd to 2nd?

[Guest 2]

Haven't driven it for any distance yet, will be doing plenty of miles tomorrow so will find out and report back.

First observations it feels smoother, maybe placebo affect but there's definitely a noticeable change.

[Bamse307]

Hey

did you feel any differnce after oil change???

[Guest 2]

Not as much as the hype suggested.

[Bamse307]

Hi guys,

I had the gearbox oil changed a couple of weeks back (using the oil I posted earlier so there was no need for the software update). They could only change 3.5 litres as that's all that came out of the sump when they drained it. The car feels at least 50% better since the change. Gear changes are smoother and the judder is much less pronounced than previously. I've ordered a new filter & gasket for the gearbox and this time I will be changing it myself over the easter break. I'll let you know how it turns out...

Six.

Did you feel any change ???? I have the same issue with low rpm In gear 4 to 5 and 5 to 6

[gupsterg]

Hi Bamse,

Chris's experience of oil change will differ from others i) as I don't think he's had any issues with his gearbox function ii) his is a later car with factory later TCM software and oil.

I know on my a6 when I had oil change it did feel smoother like an engine does on fresh oil. The biggest thing I noticed was that when I had cruise control engaged at 70 mph and disengaged it then reengaged I'd feel a clunk of the gearbox and that went after oil change and even now after a year or so still performing without that issue.

The way you describe your issue you must have early a6? also some are doing oil change just like you would on your engine as a service point of view to help prevent any issues.

[Bamse307]

Hey Gupsterg.

I have an A6 3.0 TDI allroad from july 2007 , so yes it old. But today it is at Audi service to get change the oil, but from some reason they , dont wanted in the start to change because in their little code book stand is life time oil, so i had to strugle a lot to get them to change it. I will see today if it helps

[MarkTM]

Bamse I had my 07 quattro 3.0 tip fluid and filter changed about 88k miles (you've not stated your mileage).

Not a surprise from Audi as they state 'sealed for life' but only warranty it for 80k miles (?) so many owners get them changed 80-100k.

My box was/is far smoother at lower speed changes (esp up and 2nd & 3rd). Some specialist don't recommend changing a more than 100k unless problems are experienced. If there are deposits in the tranny pan then you need too budget for a new transmission :(

[gupsterg]

Hi Bamse,

I ran some measuring blocks on my transmission for another person perhaps try them on your car, Link:- A6 3.0 TDI QUATTRO numbers - Page 4 (http://www.vwaudiforum.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?139736-A6-3-0-TDI-QUATTRO-numbers&p=781203#post781203)

Also I have private messaged you a link to more measuring blocks for gearbox perhaps something in one of those will show what happening when your experiencing fault.

[six_or_out]

Did you feel any change ???? I have the same issue with low rpm In gear 4 to 5 and 5 to 6

Yes after changing the oil a couple more times it was fine. I wouldn't say perfect but good enough.

[jubbly]

Are you guys using the sump with built in filter or just the filter kit? I'm not sure what to get for my 3.0 Quattro

[apole]

Filter, gasket and sump plug washers plus fluid is all you need. Personally I would only use Audi supplied as place I used in Bristol supplied wrong bits and were rubbish on after sales. Audi price wasn't off either. Can look up part numbers later if you need. Let me know.

Andy

[jubbly]

Ok was looking at this on eBay 111299110092. And oil 221639867055

[apole]

Hi.

Post #4 here has part numbers:

VW AUDI Forum - VWAF (http://www.vwaudiforum.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?151502-DIY-Tiptonic-Oil-and-Filter-Change-3-2-FSI-Quattro&p=926879#post926879)

I'd personally buy from Audi, Cardiff Audi do mail order and have been helpful, as have Reading, both post.

For me having the additional assurance of them checking the part number for your car and being there in case something is wrong, plus of course providing original parts is more than work an extra few pounds in cost for things like this. Appreciate everyone is different but do compare prices first as the filter kit plus postage looks on the high side to me.

[B5NUT]

Has anyone used these before Auto RepairÂ*Tollcross,Â*GlasgowÂ*|Â*Mackie Automatic & Manual Transmissions (http://www.mackie-transmission.com/home) I'm wanting to service my autobox, I don't mind doing it myself but don't have easy access to ramps, there is a local rent a ramp company, but by the time I buy the oil + parts, and then ramp time, I'll be around £200 and mackie only want £320 to do the job and that includes a flush, which I won't be able to do.

[Tabletski]

Yes is the answer, I am going there on Monday. We had an Audi/Jaguar meet there earlier this year. They look very professional and have an interesting workshop.
Several have used it and have recommended them.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[B5NUT]

Cheers, I'll give them a ring on Monday and book the car in for January.

[Scott K]

Well worth using them as the gear they have does the flush including the torque converter. I was on the tour as well and as Tabletski says, very professional. Well worth getting a look round if you can.

Has anyone used these before Auto RepairÂ*Tollcross,Â*GlasgowÂ*|Â*Mackie Automatic & Manual Transmissions (http://www.mackie-transmission.com/home) I'm wanting to service my autobox, I don't mind doing it myself but don't have easy access to ramps, there is a local rent a ramp company, but by the time I buy the oil + parts, and then ramp time, I'll be around £200 and mackie only want £320 to do the job and that includes a flush, which I won't be able to do.

[MarkTM]

Will 2nd that, it's a 400 mile trip for me but will getting mine done there in the Spring when am up there.

The key is the flushing out of all the fluid as traditionally you'll only get 70% of it out, so you'll still be using a dilution of old and new....which can't be good.

[jubbly]

Did anyone bother with 09l321371a gasket or just get the 09l321371??

[jubbly]

Audi confirmed 371a for my car it's still all come to over £60 for filter, gasket and washer

[jubbly]

Well, Changed my gearbox oil today, along with full service, nearly 110k miles, only just over 4.25 litres of oil out 5.75 in, filter changed and new gasket, seal and drain plug. Hardly any metal on the magnets, cleaned it up and got the greyish slime out, tightened the mecotronic bits up, most moved slightly, only drove 6 miles back to my house and I can say the changes are like silk now, you can hardly tell it's changed gears, not that was the reason for me to change my oil, as that problem is still there :(

If i'm driving at 30-50 mph and i come off the power my rpm starts to hunt up and down, some times it's quite violent, as if you on the brakes and off again with the revs up and down, though most the time it's fairly subtle, this seams to be still the same as before, maybe slightly better, I plan to change the oil again in 10 k when i do the next engine oil change. I'll update in a few days if it improves.

[Scott K]

I seem to remember the guys at mackie engineering mentioning something about this. It was to do with contamination of the fibre ring in the locking clutch of the torque converter. When it gets contaminated by water or worn then it can't lock up properly and you get the hunting revs. Might be completely wrong but worth a shot

[MarkTM]

Am guessing that ring contamination (oooeer matron!) is something that can only be remedied with the tranny taken apart...I think I'll do some googling.

[Scott K]

Hi Mark,
In the TC there is a locking clutch with fibre plates. The contamination attacks this I think. The problem is with the TC not the transmission but I don't know how much work is involved in changing it. The zf torque converter is a sealed unit with no way for us to get into it without a full engineering workshop. ******* Engineering cut them in half, rebuild them and weld them up. They do about 100 a week and send them all over. If the TC is knackered, the easiest option is to change it. I have also heard that BMW owners (which use the same transmission) have the same problems as us but they can work around the hunting revs by using the box in sport and using drive when cruising at motorway speeds. This has something to do wth the way the locking clutch is programmed to operate. Not sure if it would work on audis but would be worth a **** especially with an older car.

[Scott K]

Don't know why John Mackie is all asterisks! You can see their workshop on the website.

[jubbly]

Well at least it's only cost just over£100 for me to do the oil change, I could of paid £3-400 to find out it's still there :)

[Scott K]

Yes exactly. If you can get the issue to disappear by using the sport mode and are happy with that then it is a good result. Can always address the problem at a later date if you decide to keep the car.

[jubbly]

As long as you keep the power on there's no issue, I don't have any problem at motorway speeds just in town, so it's something I can live with and to be honest it's not as bad as it was, I'm hoping the fluid Chang may have made it better still, need to go for a drive me thinks :)

[MarkTM]

Don't know why John Mackie is all asterisks! You can see their workshop on the website.

Not quite sure although this site censors some weird stuff like the three letter abbreviation for Jaguar....I shall demonstrate *** *** *** :biglaugh:

[jubbly]

***

[B5NUT]

Well car booked in for the 23rd so will have a nice long run back from Mackie to see if there is any difference, will report back.

[MarkTM]

^^^ Glad to hear

Hopefully you will provide

1) Smoothness of tranny, I suspect you will have to do the adaptation yourself
2) Cost
3) How much they took out and put back in
4) Have a sample of fluid to send away for analysis or to just wonder at it's blackness!

[B5NUT]

Well I'm sitting in Mackie at the moment waiting for my gearbox to cool so it can be flushed and new oil fitted. Been talking to the engineer here and ZF now state the oil should be done with the same interval as the CVT box, so 5 year or 40K miles. Looks like I'll, be coming to Glasgow every couple of years!

[Tabletski]

Just arrived or have they started work?

I'm interested in your thoughts when they show you the filter in the system.

[B5NUT]

Been here for an hour so far, I have to wait for the gearbox oil to cool. I've not asked to see the oil or filter. But I'll ask and see if I can snap a picture.

[Scott K]

Do you think you could ask them what the oil change interval on the biturbo gearbox is? If it is the same (2 years or 40k), I'll be making a few trips down as well. I initially intended going for every 2 years anyway.

[B5NUT]

They need the gearbox code to confirm.

[B5NUT]

Ok so really not happy.... They have the TV on and it's daytime TV, who the hell watches emmerdale
:rant: :rant: :rant: :rant: :rant:

[apole]

Off topic but if u have a smartphone download a remote control app and change channels. Hope it all works out well today. Andy

[B5NUT]

Well job done and the gearbox feels a lot better, changes are at lot smoother going up the box, kick down feels quicker and smoother, and you have to look at the DIS to notice the change down. I'm going to see what the box is like in the morning, and that is when you can most notice the changes, and the gearbox feels a bit dim-witted, will also do a bit of town driving and see what that is like as it's 99.9% motorway from my house to Mackie. Will post back tomorrow.

I never got a chance to get a picture of their filter, but they said there was no metal filings in the oil, and the box was in good condition. So will take their advice and get the box done every 40K miles

The total cost was £373, £330 for the service, £40 in fuel, and £3 for a nasty sandwich, which feels like I'm still trying to digest a house brick..

[Tabletski]

Thanks for the info. I've always noticed improvements after any service. But the next day it feels normal tho' I feel better.

[B5NUT]

I never had any problems the box, sometimes there is a bit of a thud when you pull it out of park, almost like a delayed reaction. But to be honest it was worth the £370 just to find out the box is OK, and there was no filings or rubbish in the oil.

[MarkTM]

£370 inc VAT?

Also did they do the tightening sequence?

Finally how much fluid did they take out and put back, had 7.25l taken out at Bristol transmissions, but that was without the 3l or so in the TC.

[B5NUT]

Noticed a big change in the gearbox this morning, it was always sluggish in the morning before it heated up when pulling away you always had to give it more power and the gear changes were slow, this now gone and the town driving I've down the box feels a lot smother. Over all well please with the result and was well worth the money, guys at mackie transmission really do know there stuff and cannot recommend them enough.

[B5NUT]

£370 inc VAT?

Also did they do the tightening sequence?

Finally how much fluid did they take out and put back, had 7.25l taken out at Bristol transmissions, but that was without the 3l or so in the TC.

It was £330 Inc vat the other £40 was fuel to get there.

Yes they do that, but never asked how much they had taken out or put back in. They road test the cars and get the new oil up to temp then recheck the levels. They also fully flush the system in including the rad so I can only think they have to fully fill the system.

[peter goble]

Been looking to get my ATF changed for a bit now, don't fancy the drive to Glasgow from Liverpool, I have found a garage on the Wirral called Robbs Garage who "specialise" in auto transmissions, does anyone know of them, used them, any reports would be appreciated.

[jubbly]

My Surging problem is still there unfortunatly, the gear change however I thought was smooth before, it's like silk now, so still very happy to have done this.

[peter goble]

Just been quoted £585.00+vat for automatic transmission fluid change inc filter & sump from local garage. OUCH!!!!!!!!

[Tabletski]

Will you visit Glasgow then? It's only 240 motorway miles.

[MarkTM]

Mine's already booked in for 23rd of July when am up there for the Merchant City Festival....and it's 400 miles for me :D

[B5NUT]

Just been quoted £585.00+vat for automatic transmission fluid change inc filter & sump from local garage. OUCH!!!!!!!!

What they filling it with beluga caviar!

[B5NUT]

Mine's already booked in for 23rd of July when am up there for the Merchant City Festival....and it's 400 miles for me :D

Are you staying over or going to make it one hell of a long day trip.

[MarkTM]

I try to gt to the Merchant City Festival each year and book the hotel months in advance, last year was out as Commonwealth Games running and hotels were 5 x more expensive :(
(Usually get a 4 or 5 star for £60 but was £300 a night and not practical).

As there will be syncronised drinking I'll not be driving that much and am up there Thurs-Sun, since will be leaving at silly-o'clock Thursday morning (4am) will be able to leave my car with them until ready to collect on Saturday...will save me on parking too! ;) Also will give me the chance to better the 920 miles for a single tank achieved in 2013 :D

They are just 4 miles from hotel so will get a taxi there and back, really want to be there & actually see them tightening up the internals (the sceptic in me says unless I see it it didn't happen).

As had a new filter and pan 18 months ago it will just be a fluid change in my case so may be cheaper than your service...B5 does your receipt not detail how many liters were used?

[B5NUT]

No reference to how many liters used, but the system was fully flushed. I cannot see them doing anything on the cheap or cutting corners as it would not be worth their reputation and accreditation.

[_Tazman_]

Hi folks, just to revive this thread, as Im about to do the front & rear diffs on my car ( that oil is easy to get hold of, a 75w-90 fully syn GL5 oil by Ravenol VSG ), which is the same as G052 145 S2, however has ANYBODY ever changed the centre torsen diff fluid ?

My Phaeton lists this as the VSG, which contradicts the A6 TDI, as this is a 4% added sturaco mix G055 145 A2 : Wait for it, at a cost of £126 p/litre at the dealer !!!

Even the parts man had to pull himself up from the floor, surely all audis cannot be running with the same direct shift fluid, as it's listed in the service schedule as needing a change at about 60k ?

Any ideas ? It was also listed as a Castrol SAF AG 4 - Q type, I only need 1 litre for both cars !

Anybody ??? :)

[gupsterg]

oops wrong info :Blush2: ...

Too be continued :biglaugh: ...

[_Tazman_]

Cheers Gups ( hope you are well fella :) )

however the FUCHS is only VW TL 521 45-Y (G 052 145 A2) compliant.... the bit that makes it G055 145... is the sturaco additive ( comes in 50ml bottles ! )...

I did find that the ZF part number is V671 600 020 ( so may ask Bristol tranny tomoz if they can get this.... )...

still couldn't belive the audi price was £126 p/litre !

what's odd on the ravenol website is that they don't quote the G055 for the centre diff on the phaeton, but they are identical to my A6 quatto !

:)

[gupsterg]

All's well, hope your keeping good as well? :) , got :boggled: when searching p/n of oils / spec's (LOL).

Shocking price at main dealers, on ECS Tuning genuine oil 1L is $81.41, so about £55.

opieoils (http://www.opieoils.co.uk/) don't list anything related to G 055 145 A2 but maybe worth a call?

I had rear output seal done on my car soon after buying it, main dealer invoice was vague on breakdown but was £300.56 and would have assumed drain/refill of rear torsen diff.

[_Tazman_]

quick update & apologies for cluttering up this thread.... I've now sourced the elusive Sturaco additive.

Damn, damn expensive, but i can now add it to bog standard G052 145 and this makes it a G055 145 spec fluid.

Will be interesting to see how it fares on a 50k transfer box, as reading very closely into this, it's an area that almost EVERY quattro owner has never looked at. Even VW admitted they've never sold the stuff ( certainly not in the south east ).

I can only guess they don't bother & people who own quattro's put up with rumbly transmissions as they age, especially if they do sharp turns. This should be the cure.

Usually, a fluid change is all that's needed & it certanly works when you change ATF, and gear oils have a damn harder time, especially a torsen diff !

HTH

[far2tall]

Guys, I'm new to this forum having recently bought a late 2008 A6 Avant Le Mans, 3.0 TDi Quattro. It has been regularly serviced but I can't find any history of a gearbox oil change. It's done 114k miles so I'm thinking it's probably way more than overdue and I'm looking for advice on where to go to get it done. I'm not mechanically minded so would definitely not be taking this on myself. Can anyone recommend somewhere to get this done in the Berkshire area, preferably Maidenhead?

Any advice would be greatfully received - I've read through this thread but to be honest most of it goes straight over my head!

[apole]

Call Tony at Autoteknic in Wokingham, good guy.

[far2tall]

Thanks Apole, much appreciated.

[Garry_M]

am i in the clear with this gearbox;

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 02: Auto Trans Labels: 09L-927-760.lbl
Part No SW: 4F2 910 156 Q HW: 09L 927 156 C
Component: AG6 09L 3,0 TDI RdW 0060
Revision: --H05--- Serial number: 4559756
Coding: 0000001
Shop #: WSC 02325 785 00200
VCID: 336F2FA752932B86591-8066


No fault code found.


-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

[peter goble]

Will you visit Glasgow then? It's only 240 motorway miles.

To all who have contributed to this thread, I have bit the bullet and booked for ATF change in Glasgow on 26th October. going to drive up the day before so it is reasonably cool when I drop it off. will advise on how it drives on the return journey.
Quoted £275.00 + vat and will need the car for 4 to 5 hours.

[funavant]

The price seems to be right, hope you will enjoy smooth shifting after the ATF change!

[MarkTM]

And remember to get them to do the bolt tightening sequence.

[slicksurf]

Hi, can anyone recommend a garage in Birmingham for the tiptronic oil change?

[TDI JIM]

Help please!..

I am doing the full pan off + ATF oil change tomorrow afternoon and I would love to tighten the valve block too.
I have been searching for the illusive torque sequence for the mechatronic unit, but I don't have ELSA.
I have asked ZF UK directly but no response.
Does anyone have a spare minute to confirm the correct torque setting and sequence in a PM..

Thanks.

[MarkTM]

can't seem to attach it to the PM

PM me your email and I'll send it.

Mark

[funavant]

I have tried to PM you the picture, but I could not attach the file, all I could do is to copy the link into your inbox.

I can try email it to you, if you send me your email.

Martin

[gianton]

Would like to have the picture too and maybe other members. Wouldn't be easier to post it here?

Sent from my Nexus 6P using Tapatalk

[funavant]

It would, but it would also breach the copyright law.
I've tried in the past and it has been deleted.

[gianton]

Didn't know that it was copyrighted. PM sent with my email.

Sent from my Nexus 6P using Tapatalk

[MarkTM]

Well Fun, Gainton and I have PM'd so now in Jim's hands to reply :)

[funavant]

For some reason I just can't copy and past the picture from my Dropbox, only way to send it to someone else is to share it directly from Dropbox.

[TDI JIM]

Well Fun, Gainton and I have PM'd so now in Jim's hands to reply :)

Replied Mark,

Thanks to all who rose to occasion!
Love the passion & following...

[TDI JIM]

I have info!

Looking forward to it fixing a mysterious 3rd gear issue... seems that the TC is a bit lazy and slow to lock up.
All other gears are more or less perfect for the age and mileage.
Its the oil change & re-torque first. Then see how she goes!

Thanks again Mark,
Jim

[MarkTM]

BTW what's the mileage and any previous evidence of a fluid change? I had mine done at 80k and now on 130k so due another this year.

[TDI JIM]

Its on 105,000 and i very much doubt it has had a box fluid change.
Main dealer serviced until 85,000, indi service @ 92,000 then I did the last one at 101,000 when I bought it.
I have owned the car for 4 months and slowly sorting any issues it has. (3x injectors and a window reg.)

Once the pan has been off and i have checked the condition of the gearbox, I will get the EGR mapped out.

[MarkTM]

Just the EGR mapped out but no remap?

Who will you use and what do they charge?

I've had an economy remap, even with 12% extra power driving it now under WOT was like driving it before in 'S' :biglaugh:

I may have the EGR mapped out once I've replaced my manifolds as don't want 'the gunk' accumulating again.

[TDI JIM]

I have looked at 2 remap options: Mobile eco tune... or BM Conversions in Romsey.
Both are in the "Quantum group" so I'd say offer the same files with the EGR delete.
3 maps to choose from, Eco, mid & Full custom.
Having done remaps before - I do like to go for as much torque & HP as you can get, yet with this car I am probably going for the eco, as I do want the Mrs to be happy to drive it as well...
My process is: Gearbox 1st, map & delete EGR.... and then clean the manifolds.
This afternoon, I will get the car on a ramp, drop the pan and let it stand to drain overnight. Early AM, once cold, its a re-torque and pan on before refilling.
I will let you know later tomorrow how the box is after the change. I will have done somewhere between 60-100 miles in it by then.

[MarkTM]

Which fluid are you using and how much was it a litre?

The eco map has worked for me, also as less than a 15% power increase no hike in insurance premiums, before I managed 850 miles on a brimmed tank, after 920 miles, but that was exceptional driving with 2x400 mile drives in the wee hours with no traffic.

[TDI JIM]

Which fluid are you using and how much was it a litre?
before I managed 850 miles on a brimmed tank, after 920 miles.

Oil is VW/Audi from TPS, It about £12/L
Filter as well..

No way I can do that mileage on a tank, maybe 700 tops.
It has been getting better and I can easily get 40mpg on a run of 50 miles instead of pre injectors 33-36mpg

[rowdy-999]

mysterious 3rd gear issue... seems that the TC is a bit lazy and slow to lock up.


What is the issue please?

[TDI JIM]

Rowdy -
The TC clutch seems very slow to lock completely in 3rd gear after shifting from 2nd.
During normal driving, it will change from 1st to 2nd and pull, 2nd to 3rd, the revs will climb and hold at about 2-2200rpm but road speed does not change proportionally to the revs. (TC clutch slipping) Then after a few seconds, the revs will drop back as the TC clutch will lock and then pull. 3rd to 4th TC clutch locks & pulls fine same for 5th & 6th...
Occasionally the shift from 2nd to 3rd is flawless, and other times it is all over the place. It has a mind all of its own, and I have tried to find pattern but I can't find a common cause. Down shifts are fine, sometime a little hash along with some upshifts.
So, I suspect the adaptation is slightly out and the oil is old. I want to change the oil and we will check the diffs and transfer box too.

[TDI JIM]

Oil is draining, no signs of metallic contaminants. Relieved!

Oil was very dark brown, a proper "Dark n stormy" colour. No burnt smell either.

Pan will be off in the morning as it was red hot after being on the road for more than an hour.

[Scott K]

Check you are getting the correct oil as it seems vey cheap for tiptronic oil.