Why do two pd 130 engines (avf/asz) feel so different?

[dcds4]

Hi,

Bought an a4 tdi quattro recently, already have an ibiza fr tdi with the asz pd130. The audi feels so different, slow sluggish for one, i know the audi has trasmission losses and alot more weight but the engine doesnt seem to pick up like the seat does. Feels more like the engine in an old 80 tdi i once had. Has anyone else noticed this or is it just because the audi is heavy so much slower?

Any input appreciated

[Monkey117SE]

I suppose engine configuration will cause a different feel, audi cylinders being front to back, seat being side to side.

[dcds4]

interesting, could this be why the audi seems to rock as the engine starts up, feels like an engine mount is either loose or broken it moves that much

[GeorgeE]

As well as using a Mk1 eyeball on engine mounts, do a diagnostic code scan. The engine mounts are electro hydraulic and can log a code if they go faulty.

[dcds4]

As well as using a Mk1 eyeball on engine mounts, do a diagnostic code scan. The engine mounts are electro hydraulic and can log a code if they go faulty.

Sorry, whats a mk1 eyeball? I have one of those sealey vag testers from a golf i had, would this read the codes?

[white.akita]

it will feel alot different because the audi is alot heavier and you are powering 4 wheels and not just the front two on the lighter ibiza.
there is quite a difference in the front wheel drive a4 and the quattro a4 with the same avf engine.

[toff]

interesting, could this be why the audi seems to rock as the engine starts up, feels like an engine mount is either loose or broken it moves that much

Hi,

As the engine block runs the length of the engine bay (i.e. from the bulkhead towards the front bumper) you'd actually be more likely to feel a side to side rocking motion in your Seat (in which the engine runs across the width of he engine bay as pointed out by Monkey117SE). The rocking motion could be due to a worn engine mount or possibly even a malfunctioning glow-plug, meaning one cylinder (or more) isn't combusting the fuel on the first few revolution, causing a lot of vibration?

Yes the weight is a factor and yes Quattro is too, but I find my 1.9 TDI Quattro really quick as all the power comes in nice and low (I've owned a fair few fast cars, so I do have a basis for comparison).

I seriously suggest finding out how many bhp it's producing on a rolling road - although I'm not sure how cheaply you can have this done. It sounds as if it's making low power which could be because of a whole host of reasons, but the first thing I'd try is cleaning your MAF.

Toff.

[phil miller]

It sounds very much to me like a maf fault, but as already said the 4wd is a massive extra and the extra weight of the car all of these will make it feel slower

[GeorgeE]

Sorry, whats a mk1 eyeball? I have one of those sealey vag testers from a golf i had, would this read the codes?

Mk1 eyeball, you will find two fitted as standard to your head :-)

Don't know about the Sealey tester, I use Vagcom (or VCDS as it is now known). You can use a flea bay cheapo lead version to read and reset codes, you don't need the full "paid for" version.

[Doctle Odd]

1.9 is too light duty for quattro

[adamss24]

As above, the b6 audi a4 platform is very heavy as it is in FWD guise, let alone hauling the 4 wheel drive system. I found it a bit pointless when i drove the first b6 quattro really as even the v6 has issues moving all the rolling mass and that has 50 Bhp more to play with !
The old b5 tdi quattro was built with economy in mind and was very underpowered in strandard form as well. Mind you it only had 1400kg to haul about, the b6 is best part of 1650-1700 kg so it's a big difference. Both engines respond well to tuning so with a decent remap it should liven-up the drive.
If you bought the 1.9 tdi quattro for performance then you need to spend a few grand getting it above 200-220 Bhp to even compare with your pd 130 ibiza, the power to weight ratio is not in the quattro's favour !

[mikeybutch]

My son has had the 1.9 and the 2.5 as well as a couple of Subarus and I have driven them all.He now has his second S3 and thinks this is the best 4WD if you want power and Quality but its too quick for me and I prefer the Avant Q with the 2.5

[Crasher]

The only difference between the two engines (apart from the ECU mapping) is the injectors, otherwise they are interchangeable.

[miniredcooper]

Got to agree, the 1.9tdi Quattro does feel a bit slow when comparing to a front wheel drive 1.9tdi 130 especially in avant form. I actually wanted the same performance as the wifes standard A3 1.9tdi quattro out of mine so ended up with a Tunit box to see if it made a difference before going all out for a remap. Must admit it transformed the car. I know I'll get some flac from the remap or nothing squad, but the wee box does what I need it to, MPG+, and properly set up no exhaust smoke. In fact ended up keeping it on the car as it meets my needs and 1.5yrs down the line has caused no problems One criticism is the power band seems slightly limited in the rev range, but not a big problem. I've never turned it up past half way, and it does all i need - just that wee bit extra oomph. And the extra MPG on the long motorway runs helps.

I wouldn't change the quattro though, the car just sticks and gives you great confidence. Decent tyres and it will see off anything. I actually now enjoy hitting standing water on the motorway - as she ploughs on with none of the skitters I used to get from the 3 series.

[dcds4]

Thanks for the replies, very useful. I didnt buy the quattro expecting it to be fast, i test drove loads of s3's before buying the ibiza and i wouldnt say they felt particularly fast either. It just felt at first like there was a fair difference between the engines, most notably the sound, ibiza revs up fast whereas the audi sounds like an old tractor. Overall i am very pleased with the car, good grip, comfort and reasonable street cred..

[benjie]

I wouldn't change the quattro though, the car just sticks and gives you great confidence. Decent tyres and it will see off anything. I actually now enjoy hitting standing water on the motorway - as she ploughs on with none of the skitters I used to get from the 3 series.

Really well put, especially with the wet road/standing rain comment. (Put far more succinctly than I could ever could!) There are better (and more complicated) 4WD systems out there, but the torsen quattro we have on our B6's is spot on and bulletproof. I will never happily buy a 2WD car again unless it is a seriously good bit of kit!

[miniredcooper]

whereas the audi sounds like an old tractor. .

Worth having a good listen under the bonnet. My car gets a wee bit noisier just before a service, but also you can get some pretty agricultural noises from an alternator pulley or Air con compressor pulley that are on their way.

My cars air con compressor pulley is going ATM and its almost embarassing the nasty noise it's making at idle. Sounds much more massey ferguson than vorsprung durch!

[pollum]

Really well put, especially with the wet road/standing rain comment. (Put far more succinctly than I could ever could!) There are better (and more complicated) 4WD systems out there, but the torsen quattro we have on our B6's is spot on and bulletproof. I will never happily buy a 2WD car again unless it is a seriously good bit of kit!
This is the meaning of quattro. you can literately take the p with this car. wet snow grass gravel whatver you throw at it. i have a 330 bmw e46 and i can honestly say it feels slower under normal driving and the amount she drinks! i've never driven/owned a car which has pretty much ticked all the boxes. 1.9 tdi quattro all the way or FTW as the new breed puts it.