CV Boots

[Peter_HMR]

Just noticed on by B5.5 that the boots on the CV joints have totally split. Not sure how long these have been on the car I've put 14k on it since I bought it.

How do you know when the CV joints need to be replaced?

Are these ok or am I going to start having problems soon?

Do I need to replace the whole joint or can I just replace the boot and regrease the joint?

[Issac Hunt]

Inspect them before fitting new boots and re-greasing. If they are rusted/pitted/worn etc then you'll need new one's but a re-grease them first and clean out all the muck and try them.

If they are worn then they will usually click/knock when cornering. I'd try new grease and boots first - much cheaper!

[Peter_HMR]

Are the grease and boots a VW specific part or will a generic from a motor factors be ok.

[PeteK]

The cv joints normally last a very long time, however they start to wear out rapidly as soon as the gaitors split allowing dirt and grit to mix with the grease inside which creates a grinding paste! Get the gaitors replaced asap and make sure the cv is thoroughly cleaned and new grease fitted. My original gaitors lasted until 140k miles when one split, luckily I noticed it early as I could see the grease splattered on the wheelarch liner. I would recommend you fit genuine gaitors also as they last much longer.

[yaman]

Are the grease and boots a VW specific part or will a generic from a motor factors be ok.

A motor factors will have passat boots, universal boots are
a wast of time.

As above, small stones get stuck in the old grease, wash with
a small paint-brush and paraffin.

Regards
Jim

[Peter_HMR]

I got passat ones today. Do I need to get a special crimping tool for the clamp or is there a different fix for this?

Also I got some brake/clutch cleaner/degreaser for my intake system would you recommend using this to clean out the old grease from the join or will I stick with the parifine (would kerosene work ok).

[yaman]

I got passat ones today. Do I need to get a special crimping tool for the clamp or is there a different fix for this?

Also I got some brake/clutch cleaner/degreaser for my intake system would you recommend using this to clean out the old grease from the join or will I stick with the parifine (would kerosene work ok).

I use wide cable-ties.

Kerosene is as good as paraffin.

Regards
Jim

[caldirun]

I got passat ones today. Do I need to get a special crimping tool for the clamp or is there a different fix for this?

Also I got some brake/clutch cleaner/degreaser for my intake system would you recommend using this to clean out the old grease from the join or will I stick with the paraffin (would kerosene work ok).
I bought a cheap pair of Chinese pincers from the pound shop and ground them, made a perfect tool

[mwvw]

You can get a CV Band Tool and Strap and Clips on Evil Bay :- http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/CV-Drive-Shaft-Boot-Securing-Tool-Stainless-Band-Clips-/310106174025?pt=UK_Hand_Tools_Equipment&hash=item4833c4b249
but at £49 +p&p may be a bit pricey for a one off replacement but may be cost effective if doing it a few times

[muddy]

Like earlier post I have found the original boots OK up to about 130,000 miles. Had one split on my 1.8T at 145,000.
Had just had both split on our 1.8 n/a at 130,000 approx.

Just bought a pair of the stretchy neoprene ones (made/sold by Bailcast) from local motor factor and ordered a cone tool for fitting.

The theory is that you can fit the proper stretchy ones (not just any boot) over the outer CV joint without needing to pull the joint from the shaft.
I will let you know how it works out.

[vwcabriolet1971]

I've leant from experience that the genuine VW boots last longer than the aftermarket types. Also the genuine boot kits come with the correct grease and the correct amount of grease.

[muddy]

I've leant from experience that the genuine VW boots last longer than the aftermarket types. Also the genuine boot kits come with the correct grease and the correct amount of grease.


Hmmm.
Maybe. But that is what VW would have us believe and I was taught to ask questions and not take statements as gospel.
What actual mileage did you get out of aftermarket boots and on what car?
And did you fit them or leave it to the garage?
I only ask because it was apparent from another forum that someone had tried stretching non-neoprene boots ...... and of course they split.

The last pair I changed was on a Saab Turbo and they were still perfectly OK after another 60,000 miles.

Bear in mind that VW wants to pay 50p per boot (or less) when buying in bulk and would not be interested in neoprene boots at, say, £1.50 in bulk.

Nothing to say aftermarket boot kits from UK motor-trade suppliers such as Bailcast don't come with correct moly grease and in the correct quantity unless you can be more specific of course with a previous bad experience.

[vwcabriolet1971]

I've found that the later VW model car CV boots do last a lot longer than than the earlier models . My 11 year old MK 4 Golf at 145K miles had the original boots although they did show some hair line cracking in the "valleys" on the outer boots.
I base my experience on the earlier models ( MKs 2& 3), which the factory parts seem to last about 90K miles or about 7 years . The aftermarket parts at that time seemed to last only about 50K or at most 4 years ( some as soon as 3 years). These aftermarket kits had inferior quality clips and did not include any grease. The pattern boots did not appear as flexible as the VW item.
If the current VW CV boots last about 10 years and 150K then why would you want to use an unknown, unproven quality part given the time , dirt and trouble it takes to change them ? To save a few pounds at most ? But if you enjoy changing them, then each to his own ! I've always checked boots at DIY oil change time and have changed any suspect boots early rather than leaving it till they split. But how much longer my knees will hold out is anyone's guess ! I've never tried to stretch any boots over the joint . I don't think any boot is designed to stretch over the joint - I'm sure the factory don't do it. Just because it's possible does not mean that stretching will not harm the boot. Most of the times I've taken the whole drive shaft off for joint cleaning and greasing.
To me this is a no brainer - use the proven parts.

[caldirun]

I've learnt from experience that the genuine VW boots last longer than the aftermarket types. Also the genuine boot kits come with the correct grease and the correct amount of grease.
Totally agree, I compared the prices of "cheap" boots with no grease and the real thing, then bought VAG, only snag was the steel straps but a pair of pincers ground to fit did the job for a quid! 70,000 miles on and still clean wheels (they will split tomorrow now I've wrote this!)

[muddy]

Well I'll fly the flag for the neoprene stretchy ones.

Made in Britain (firm in Lancashire) not imported from the Far East.

Bailcast have a short video on their website showing just how easy it is to put them on with the garage-kit stretching tool or the DIY-kit cone.

Bailcast have a patent or two which is not normally granted lightly.

BUT just discovered my Factor has sold me type 400 instead of type 100 as per website application list.

That means another £5-worth of petrol wasted returning to change £11-worth of parts .......................:aargh4:

[caldirun]

Well I'll fly the flag for the neoprene stretchy ones.

Made in Britain (firm in Lancashire) not imported from the Far East.

Bailcast have a short video on their website showing just how easy it is to put them on with the garage-kit stretching tool or the DIY-kit cone.

Bailcast have a patent or two which is not normally granted lightly.

BUT just discovered my Factor has sold me type 400 instead of type 100 as per website application list.

That means another £5-worth of petrol wasted returning to change £11-worth of parts .......................:aargh4:
Can't see the point in these, all the hard work is in getting the hub off. Once you have got this far its a few screws on the inboard flange to remove the lot, pop the joint in a bench vice, one sharp tap and you can CLEAN the joint throughly. If you are replacing the boot, its split, if its split its let in s..t, you have to clean, inspect and re-grease, do a proper job!

[muddy]

Can't see the point in these, all the hard work is in getting the hub off. Once you have got this far its a few screws on the inboard flange to remove the lot, pop the joint in a bench vice, one sharp tap and you can CLEAN the joint throughly. If you are replacing the boot, its split, if its split its let in s..t, you have to clean, inspect and re-grease, do a proper job!

The point is that I have to drive a 50 mile round-trip to the dealers. They hold next-to-no spares stock these days so you have to order and return or phone up and wait a day or two.

No big problem but SERVICE is no longer of interest. They are happy to sell me a new car or service it at £** per hour.

For roughly fourty years I have done all my own servicing and totally rebuilt several vintage and classic cars as a hobby. Not paying anyone else for anything except spray painting.
So that includes engine, gearbox and axle rebuilds, bodies built from drawings and panelled, wiring harnesses designed and made, adaptors designed from scratch and made (last one was a Rover V8 to Mercedes-Benz gearbox), brakes converted from cable to hydraulic operation, instruments stripped and repaired, etc.
No real need to have a dig and remind me to do a proper job, just accept my assurance that I always do.
----------------------------------
The quality of the neoprene boots is excellent, the clips are the correct crimp-up OE type (not zip-ties) and below is the reply I received from Bailcast when I asked about grease :-

"Many thanks for your enquiry. I trust you are referring to Bailcast
boxed CV kits. These kits are also sold to all the major distributors
such as Quinton Hazell, Unipart, First Line, Euro Car Parts, A.M.K. and
Motaquip, and 50% of our sales are exported. Some annual sales
statistics:-
DBC Duraboot CV boots 500,000 sold annually
CV96 Universal boots 150,000 sold annually
CV88 Maxiboot 9,000 sold annually
CVS18 Split boot 55,000 sold annually

We also package the CV grease for many other customers who sell CV boots and never, ever, have we had a complaint about the quality/quantity of the grease in our sachets. Our grease is supplied by a well known UK
manufacturer and has been for many years. Bailcast celebrated its 30th
anniversary this year, a milestone we would not have reached if we sold
poor quality goods."

[caldirun]

[QUOTE=muddy;579464]"No real need to have a dig and remind me to do a proper job, just accept my assurance that I always do. "[QUOTE]
Sorry, I thought you were going to mess about like the bloke in the video you told us to watch, if strip and clean the joint then fit them can't see a problem.

[charlescampion]

Recently carried out this job myself & it is easier than you might think if you go about it in the correct manner.

Can email or "post" you a "Job sheet" if you wish.

Re: the boots I would recommend the VW ones as they are more robust than the alternatives, are easier to fit, saves messing around & needing to repeat the job sooner than necessary. Personally would not bother with the neoprene ones & there is no need anyway.

Re: Band tool a pair of reasonably sized blunt pincers does the job fine.

[Chipped2]

I have only ever used VW replacement boot kits.

My Sept 2002 Passat Sport Estate original boots lasted to and were replaced as follows;

Nearside; 5/10/2007 at 103436k is now showing small cracks in largest dia. crease.

Offside; 13/09/2007 at 88003k and was replaced yesterday 14/11/2010 at 141300.

It is clear that the genuine replacements do not last as long as the original Factory parts plus the cost has risen considerably at £23.93 + Vat. per VW set.
The items were ordered so would be fresh when collected on 13/11/2010 and bear the 'sell by date' of 2014.

I would welcome a none VW part if fit and quality could be guaranteed.

My CV Joint bears the VW Audi logo and DE GWM 4D0 407 305B The cost of an exchange CV Joint is currently £157.09 inc and outright is £244 !!

Aftermarket CV outright price is £59 + Vat with a £5 discount if I collect in the Midlands. Amazingly it includes boot and stainless steel clips. Am calling in to see one as the price is so amazing and will report what I find.

Re. tightening clips. It can be done very effectively with two small blunt round nails placed either side of the crimp point. Squeezing with Vise Grips or with Mole grips gives a very professional finish and doesn't risk cutting the clip with sharp pincers. The above grips are geared so require less effort than pincers.
Make up a piece of steel wire into a long parrallel 'U' shape to keep in your toolbox to do the same job.

[muddy]

Recently carried out this job myself & it is easier than you might think if you go about it in the correct manner.

Can email or "post" you a "Job sheet" if you wish.

Re: the boots I would recommend the VW ones as they are more robust than the alternatives, are easier to fit, saves messing around & needing to repeat the job sooner than necessary. Personally would not bother with the neoprene ones & there is no need anyway.

Re: Band tool a pair of reasonably sized blunt pincers does the job fine.

Thanks for that kind offer. I have just made a start on the job (now that the cone for fitting the stretchy boots has arrived via Royal Mail) and I should be OK having changed a drive shaft on the 1.8T a couple of months back.
I took the precaution when I bought the second Passat last year of removing and replacing both pinch bolts at the top of the uprights. Used copper grease so should be easy to do that part.

Incidentally I found one bolt undid relatively easily but the original near-side bolt was well seized.
I sheared the head off the bolt with a breaker bar and then put a couple of extra washers under the nut. Add WD40.
Gently tapped two slots with the tapered end of a drift to 'shock' the bolt slightly and disturb the corrosion.
Tightened nut up and it pulled the bolt shank through after a little initial resistance.

I too use a pair of blunted nail removing pincers to carefully tighten this design of clip.

[caldirun]

I took the precaution when I bought the second Passat last year of removing and replacing both pinch bolts at the top of the uprights. Used copper grease so should be easy to do that part.
.
You may not need to remove any joints to do the boots, I did both sides with out and lots of other posters have done so.

[muddy]

You may not need to remove any joints to do the boots, I did both sides with out and lots of other posters have done so.


That is a bummer. This afternoon I got both driveshafts out and did so with removed pinch bolts.
There was a bit of wangling to get the shafts out even with the upright swung well to one side.

I did remember that in actual fact I didn't cut the heads off the bolts (on my 1.8T or the 1.8 n/a).
With a 16mm socket and a breaker bar I sheared them off after judicious tapping with a copper hammer on the housing and on the threaded end.
Touch of WD40 into slits. Tapped wedge into splits to open them up a fraction. Put nut and washers on and wound out the rusty bolt shank.

Also noticed that my Castrol tin of moly grease says it is ideal for CV joints so will be putting a bit back into inner joints before bolting them to flange..

[muddy]

And, yes, I can see that unless you were just changing boots as a precautionary measure because of cracks appearing in the valleys (and therefore no dirt in the joint, then there would always be a compelling case for stripdown, clean-out and re-grease.

For now the cone for stretchy boots can sit unused on the shelf.

[Chipped2]

Aftermarket CV Joint.

Further to the above posting and having rebuilt my outer CV Joint with a genuine VW Boot Kit I collected a new aftermarket CVJ for my 2002 Passat Sport Estate 130 TDI from a CVj specialist in Willenhall, West Mids. Cost was £54 plus Vat collected. ( Mail order £5 extra if required.)

Item was well boxed, allegedly manufactured in the USA, and was complete with a Boot Kit too. It comprised;

CV Joint, Centre bolt, rubber boot with stainless steel clips, tube of grease and 'C' clip. Thrown in for free were 4 extra S/S large and 4 small clips and 4 extra sachets of grease.

Don't usually buy aftermarket but with the cost of VW CVJ's so high and with only one vehicle in the depths of Mid Wales, I consider it a worthwhile insurance to keep my car on the road to obtain the genuine VW exchange item. With VW replacement boot kits alone only lasting 3 years it has to be a worthwhile purchase.

The company is ; DRIVE SHAFT (UK). Unit 4, Victoria Buildings, Newhall Street, Willenhall. WV13 1LQ. Tel: 01902 602100. Mobile: 07714 292801. Technical Helpline; 07808 000550. Email: sales@driveshaftuk.com
Website: www.driveshaftuk.com (http://www.driveshaftuk.com) Less than a mile from Junc. 10 M6.

I have no connection with the above company .

[muddy]

Looks like good value for a whole CV joint.

I DID end up stripping down and cleaning out the two CV joints.

Very easy to pop the ball bearings out and rotate both inner cages until they came out.

Putting it back together was just a touch like a Rubic cube!

Finding exactly the right angle for the inner cages took a short time.

By the way, there was plenty of moly CV grease in the Bailcast sachets.

I reckon one of the split boots had already been replaced by a previous owner as the clips were made of zinc-coated steel rather than stainless. And, rather more telling, the central bolt was only tightened to about 50ft lbs and had traces of copper grease on the threads.